Ask Lemmy

That was overblown drama. They didn't change anything in practice. They clarified things by writing it down. You disable some defaults and have no issue. Even if you don't, it's not nearly as bad as other popular platforms.

I never stopped using Firefox.

If you want I can look for a comment I made quoting the relevant terms a while back. Or you can look for it yourself.

Simple forks still depend on upstream. I'd rather support Mozilla than not, given no better sustainable alternative. They do some good stuff like Firefox, Thunderbird, and mdn.

wait people stopped using Firefox? I've been rocking it since like 2006/2007

The world in general switched from Firefox to Chrome several years ago because at that time (when just released) Chrome was new, shiny, and fast (much faster than Firefox). And at that time everyone loved Google (they still had their infamous "be no evil" motto). And Google also promoted their browser, and, given their web resources are immensely popular, that helped tremendously.

That switch had nothing to do with recent concerns about privacy in Mozilla products.

i think when they killed weave. such a dick move. one of many. may the CEO get most out of the bribe they get from google for selling out its users. i muria even the free and open things are shit.

You guys stopped? :: looks around nervously::

I just use Librewolf

"We" didn't stop using Firefox. Open source boycotts are complicated because the software is separate from the developers. You can keep using the software even if you disagree with the development organisation.

Mozilla organisation is getting problematic for a whole lot of reasons. My issue with them is that they seem to be in the "more money than they know what to do with it" phase. They're flush with cash, but it's not reflecting to the product. If they buy an ad company and plan AI stuff, maybe things aren't going well.

Problem is, there's no viable competing organisation. Protest forks of software don't really work that well unless you can actually guarantee the development support. Compare this to what happened when OpenOfficeOrg successfully moved to LibreOffice - developers saw the old organisation didn't work, so they made a new one that did.

I stopped using it and went to chrome bc my adblock stopped working and i waited for a fix but it didn't come. It worked fine on chrome.

I went back to firefox bc my adblock stopped working but it worked fine on firefox.

these two events are several years apart if that wasn't clear

We did?

I stopped using Firefox for four core reasons:

Their investment into AI How they submit and work with their Google overlords to some degree Their browser putting in more and more unnecessary and unasked features (like Firefox account for one) Their Terms of Service

Who is this "we" you talk of?

Who is this "we"? I still use it, never stopped.

I never stopped using it. There are privacy issues with all browsers. I like how Firefox works, but I regularly end up using Firefox, chrome, and edge all at the same time. I use them for some compartmentalization of my tasks and work lol

When? There have been a few times people stopped using Firefox in large numbers.

One of them was when Chrome first came out. Firefox (and every other browser) at the time ran every site in one process. As sites became more reliant on Javascript, which was usually poorly written, that meant any one tab having a problem made other sites and even the browser's own UI unresponsive, or sometimes crashed the whole browser. Chrome's multiprocess model was a revelation. Firefox didn't get its own implementation until 2016.

Recently, there's been some movement away from Firefox due to Mozilla making decisions people don't feel align with open source, the open web, and privacy. The one that has me looking at forks is the planned addition of terms of use to the browser. Terms of use are for an ongoing relationship between a service operator and a user; Firefox is local software I'm operating myself on a computer I own. Its fine for optional online services like Sync to have terms of use, but the browser should work without those.

Misinformation

The thing is, I never have. Chrome is absolute hot garbage and spyware, all the Chromium forks are all flawed and bugged and still feed into Google's dominance because of engine and stupid Manifest bullshit. Firefox, despite all the stupid things Mozilla did and still does just works the best and is not Chromium.

Firefox is essential for its various forks even if you have gripes with it

Still using it here

I never fully did, but I did end up using Chromium more than I wanted to:

1. Some poorly written sites refuse to work with FF. My water company, for example. They eventually fixed it after I complained multiple times. Now they display a warning that it's "Optimized for Chrome" but no longer flat out prevent FF from logging in (you know, to pay bills and such).
2. FF Desktop still doesn't support PWAs, and their recent update says they're working on it, but they're half-assing it (installed web apps will still have the menu bars, address, bar etc). I self-host a lot of web applications and want them to appear like native apps. Hence, Chromium.
3. There was some recent ToS / Privacy Policy change, and everyone was knee-jerking "time to abandon Firefox" as if there's anywhere better to go. (This is probably what you're thinking of)
4. A good while back, Chrom(ium) was just flat-out faster. That's been a while, and I think when FF's "Quantum" update (or whatever it was called) came out in like 2016 or 2017, it put it back on par.

I believe you're thinking of a ToS change where the wording was incredibly vague, leading to some outlets to claim they were selling browsing data to 3rd parties and AI modelers. They changed it right after to specify that the data they were using wasn't browsing data, and the data they did gather wouldn't be used for AI. They are not as invasive as google, but you're subject to Google on Firefox because of the ubiquity of their telemetry and search optimizations across websites. Firefox with an add-on such as noscript is much better than Chrome still, in my opinion. At the very least, it's nice to have a browser that doesn't work to undermine its own add-on functionalities.

Firefox is better than most but still smugly makes anti-user changes which are complete dog shit.

Remember when they turned off your ability to choose to load extensions that weren’t signed, because fuck you?

Fuck Pepperidge farm, I remember that shit.

Or how about DNS over https, because fuck you, user, why should you have any say over name resolution when you might use that power to block ads and malware?

The recent main one seemed to be no longer promising to not sell user data, but it's been a culmination of little things.

https://www.zdnet.com/article/the-firefox-i-loved-is-gone-how-to-protect-your-privacy-on-it-now/

Personally I've been kind of miffed since they decided to use the experiments feature to be paid to shill for the Mr. Robot tv show, including in their enterprise release, making people think they got hacked. But that was years ago and forgotten.

I've been back to Firefox for about a year now. Left chrome for it.

Because Librewolf exists and Mozilla became an adware vendor.

I recently tried to migrate to Firefox after the v2 extension changes in Chrome. I worked, but there were a few things that bothered me.

Chrome and chromium browsers will automatically use the window last used in the MacOS workspace you are in, and this usually works nicely when you have a work workspace and a personal workspace. It keeps things nicely separated when you click on links. Firefox doesn’t do that. It uses whatever window you last accessed. Not the end of the world.

The real problem I had is that the performance when using web tools like grafana in Firefox is so much worse compared to chromium based browsers. It was unbearable. I haven’t tried WebKit yet to see the same services in safari, for example.

Changing to opt-out telemetry from opt-in is the one I remember people fussing over

I am lazy and have yet to switch to a new fork.

I use IronFox because firefox decided to support bad practices. Kinda like google removing "don't be evil".

I don't even remember many times Firefox/Mozilla has changed its extension API and broken everyone's add-ons. It gets tiresome.

There was some uproar when they essentially de-committed to supporting MDN/developer tools in 2020

...we are reducing investment in some areas such as developer tools, internal tooling, and platform feature development, and transitioning adjacent security/privacy products to our New Products and Operations team...