this post was submitted on 25 Mar 2026
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Fallout

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Obsidian "killed it"

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[–] sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 6 hours ago* (last edited 5 hours ago)

Are you fucking kidding me?

These goobers (Bethesda) tried, and somewhat succeeded at a semi-working prototype of implementing a more cohesive, world-faction-conflict paradigm.

https://www.eurogamer.net/inside-the-unpredictable-goblin-wars-of-the-elder-scrolls-4-oblivion-i-introduced-controlled-chaos-whenever-i-could

Oblivion has the Goblin Wars, which is mostly a simulated system that runs in the background, out of sight of the player, that determines how some minor factions will fight over territory.

Then, they just forgot about it, and did not include it in FO3.

Probably because it was half-broken, what a surprise.

"I don't remember the specifics, but the goblin war was stretching the limits of our game systems, especially the AI and scripting," Kuhlmann says. "My guess is that because of the scripted nature of the goblin wars system, when you use Wait the scripts aren't getting updated properly." It might be that the time the goblins set out from their base falls in the middle of a Wait period, and so isn't triggered when that time is skipped. "You might try short Waits of one hour," Kuhlmann suggests. "Or just let game time pass naturally and see if that makes a difference."

So here, in the OP article, we have fucking GOOBERS saying:

"We made 90% of the art, we built the engine, we did it in a very limited window of time, and we put in all this effort, and they got to just work on the stories."

No, you fucking asshole, you gave them a half broken mess, and they figured out how to do a much more scaled up version of what you couldn't figure out how to do, by way of working around the mess you gave them, in more clever ways.

Also, you didn't 'build the engine' in a 'very limited window of time'. You... purchased a liscense to use Gamebryo. And you customized that... rather messily, and then let Obsidian use your mess.

"As time has gone on, Obsidian killed it," Lobe proclaims. "It did make me feel a little bit sad that our design team could not implement the same scale of really ambitious, multi-arc hug choices, kind of thing."

Yeah, yes, the broad strokes of that have been obvious to most people who played Bethesda games in that time, have you heard of this Hbomberguy person, maybe?

But you... would have known much more of the details about how the whole Goblin Wars thing just got abandoned.

... Butthurt, egotistical goobers.

Literally enough time has passed that Harry doesn't even have hair anymore.

The man has developed, accepted, and embraced male pattern baldness... in the amount of time it took you to fully absorb a video he made a decade ago.

Fuck Bethesda.

... They even had a framework to do this with Fallout 4.

You know the whole mods based off of competing settlements?

You could have just done that. Made it into a kind of open world / sim hybrid, sorta like Kenshi.

Abandoned your terrible storyline, and made a world where there's an emergent story line, where different games play out differently, because faction settlements and conflicts play out differently, different sets of world conditions enable different sets of or variants of major and minor quests.

But that can only work if you actually have a really solid, clever, and compute efficient background simulation manager.

You know, stable, without bugs, well optimized.

Things that Bethesda isn't capable of making.

[–] Tempus_Fugit@lemmy.world 44 points 14 hours ago (3 children)

I'm sorry, but Bethesda has been shit at the Fallout games. New Vegas is leaps and bounds better than the other FPS Fallouts in terms of immersion. It's not even close.

[–] HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club 7 points 12 hours ago

From what I heard, Fallout: London was pretty good and that was fan made.

[–] Klear@quokk.au 3 points 12 hours ago (2 children)

Yeah. TES is great. You start as a prisoner nobody and work your way to demigod status and it works. It's meant to be a power fantasy.

But it just doesn't work with Fallout. I tried to get through FO4 but I just can't. It's like a post-apocalyptic amusement park.

[–] cheat700000007@lemmy.world 1 points 5 hours ago

With the worst dialogue system in any RPG I've ever played

[–] A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 4 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

Fallout 4's basically a looter shooter set in a vaguely fallout-like world.

Which is understandable why you cant get through it. You probably want something more meaningful, like new vegas, instead of generic looter shooter 45 with fallout lore collab.

[–] sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 5 hours ago

Its also not a very good looter-shooter.

It has a bunch of side mechanics to keep you busy, to keep you basically fighting the auto level scaling...

But the actual combat is mind numbingly simple for anyone who's played a decent number of FPSs, the enemy AI is... not good.

[–] Agent_Karyo@piefed.world 30 points 14 hours ago (3 children)

New Vegas was IMO peak Obsidian, they've gotten a bit more commercial in the last ~5 years.

I also thought Obsidian's Alpha Protocol was underrated (although it was flawed and buggy).

[–] A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 4 points 9 hours ago

Alpha Protocol was an absolutely, insanely awesome game. You can play that game 10 fucking times, and get a different ending every time. And the story, and the game play, and everything, were just 12/10.

GOD I LOVE ALPHA PROTOCOL.

Fucking Sega are assholes for refusing to green light a second one.

[–] DivineDev@piefed.social 15 points 14 hours ago

Well, which Obsidian Game isn't flawed and buggy? (half /s)

I'd also add Knights of the old Republic 2 to the list of peak Obsidian Games.

[–] VerilyFemme@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

Josh Sawyer's passion project Pentiment was amazing as well!

[–] DivineDev@piefed.social 7 points 13 hours ago* (last edited 13 hours ago) (1 children)

Eh I couldn't really get into it. What bothered me is that every time I had to accuse someone I had the feeling that none of the available options were correct, but the game still forced me to pick. Then later when I had the actual culprit mostly figured out I had no opportunity to investigate it further before the game actually wanted me to find them. The game felt like it wanted to give choices to the player, but then the developers seemingly didn't want to implement the various ways these choices can play out. I understand this would be very hard, but giving the impression of choice and then not really having much choice when you actually try feels like bad game design to me.

The artstyle was pretty cool at least.

[–] VerilyFemme@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

Hmm, I feel I was able to snoop in on a lot more detail with how the character system was set up. But I also never replayed.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the point that you can't actually conclusively solve the mystery?

[–] DivineDev@piefed.social 1 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

It's been a while since I've played but the murders have a definite perpetrator and motive in the end iirc, but there's probably some minor plot lines that aren't conclusively solved.

spoilerIt was Father Thomas together with Sister Amalie, who was manipulated by him. He didn't want people to find out that the locally worshipped saints were actually derived from Roman deities.

[–] Ioughttamow@fedia.io 1 points 8 hours ago

I got the impression that he murdered the second guy (and the prior abbot as well), but for the first murder had merely manipulated the death

[–] Zahille7@lemmy.world 12 points 12 hours ago (4 children)

Fucking why are we still getting articles and shit about this? 16 years of this shit isn't enough?

Don't get me wrong, I love New Vegas, but this constant glazing/circlejerk of this game year after year is getting ridiculous.

[–] sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 5 hours ago

Because after a zenith, comes a nadir.

And in the nadir, people look back to the zenith, to try to figure out what went wrong, and what can be learned from it, to try to move toward a new dawn.

[–] tio_bira@lemmy.world 9 points 11 hours ago

Because of the sad state of creativity stagnation than modern AAA videogame are.

Yeah there indie games, sometimes done by people who used to work on those titles, like New Vegas, Morrowind, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, etc, but their are in different scopes, mostly always lack some things who would make then perfect.

In the last two generations of consoles, i can count on my fingers the games who did things right like on Old Games, Baldur's Gate 3 is one of them, with Lariant sharping their skills with the D:OS duology to deliver a experience like that, and The Witcher 3, beside the main story such but the side quests and world building are top tier.

[–] tal@lemmy.today 3 points 9 hours ago

Fucking why are we still getting articles and shit about this?

I mean, the last mainline single-player Fallout game was Fallout 4. If you preferred Fallout: New Vegas to it, then that's maybe the Fallout game you like best.

Fallout 76 is an online multiplayer game.

Fallout 5 isn't going to come out for some time.

[–] BigBananaDealer@lemmy.world 6 points 12 hours ago

it makes it hard to even talk about new vegas anymore

[–] cerebralhawks@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 13 hours ago (3 children)

New Vegas was the better RPG, but Fallout 3 was more fun, and it's a shame that New Vegas came after. They saw what worked and what didn't in 3, and made their game after. Technically New Vegas was built on top of 3, but I'm not talking about that. I mean, it doesn't matter for what we're talking about, beyond that they didn't have to build a whole game engine from the ground up, they just did the equivalent of Enderal and built a total conversion mod on top of Fallout 3.

Specifically, Fallout 3 had the fun guns like the Railway Rifle and the Dart Gun, and New Vegas had packs of nearly-unbeatable Deathclaws. Fallout 3 also had Three Dog.

Other than that, New Vegas was better.

[–] A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 3 points 9 hours ago

The problem with Fallout 3 is its less of a game, than it is a collection of short stories.

Cause every settlement and almost everything you do is basically done in isolation with little to no impact in the world.. that instead of the game being one big epic book, it just ends up being a compilation of a bunch of okay to mediocre short stories trying to pretend to be a big epic book.

There is no living wasteland, its just setpiece stories separated by random, and sometimes bullshit, combat.

[–] FilthyShrooms@lemmy.world 7 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

Maybe a hot take but I prefer my packs of deathclaws nearly-unbeatable

[–] A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 2 points 9 hours ago

Pepperidge Farm remembers back when the only way to kill a death claw was to shoot it in the eye with a high powered weapon..

[–] Zahille7@lemmy.world 6 points 12 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago)

Gangs of deathclaws, packs of nightstalkers, and don't forget the clusters of cazadores that'll fuck you up the instant they notice you.

[–] tensor_nightly69@lemmy.world 7 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

Just got it on the Steam spring sale ($0.99) - now even more excited to play it for the first time!

[–] IntrovertTurtle@lemmy.zip 7 points 12 hours ago

I highly recommend the Tale of Two Wastelands mod. It requires Fallout 3 to also be installed, and imports all of FO3 into the engine version of NV. Then, it makes you able to go between them both and chose which one you start in!

If you NG from Vegas, you start with a letter from your dad about having left the vault. You can get all the companions from either game, experience either games' story/dlc/etc. You have to reach a certain point in the game but there's a station to change maps with all your gear and such. Even gun stations in the Capital Wastes.

They even have a list of other mods vetted to work along side it as well!

[–] FelixCress@lemmy.world 4 points 14 hours ago