For the blackout concerns: if you have solar panels, irrelevant, actually you'd be in a better place than with an ICE car. Also, if you have a garage, a fairly powerful generator cost peanuts compared to the price of a car, and some can run on gas cilinders and gasoline. Way safer to store gas cilinders than gas.

Long drives. Decades ago I drove with my ex and my in laws from Madrid to Brussels in one go. 2 of us taking turns.I swore to never do more than 800 Km in one go. We did it in a largish car, pretty comfortable. Yeah, no.

[–] vaultdweller013@sh.itjust.works 1 points 8 minutes ago

I like cars, I like the idea of EVs, I fucking hate modern cars (post 08 give or take) so imagine my opinions on most EVs. Just give me an electric Mule or a converted old beater I'll be happy, if it's basically anything else I better have the capacity to turn it into an EV equivalent of a dune buggy because I do not respect modern car design in the slightest, don't care if it's Chinese, Japanese, European, or American they all have shitty interiors an over reliance on electronics and generally have too many "comfort" features designed to compensate for incompetent design or drivers.

[–] llii@discuss.tchncs.de 5 points 57 minutes ago

I got an EV last year and I woulld never go back. It's just so much better.

[–] AbsolutelyNotAVelociraptor@piefed.social 48 points 4 hours ago (10 children)

As an EV owner, I have recieved an interesting amount of reasons why people won't buy them:

The autonomy is not real (so far it's been in my case and in any case, in italy, for how people drive, the declared consumptions are all fake because people here only drives by pressing the accelerator to the bottom)
What if there's a blackout in the whole city and you can't charge your car? (The whole city, for a long time? I'd be worried about other stuff, but go on...)
What if all the public plugs are occupied when you want to charge and you find yourself without battery to go to "ork tomorrow? (ALL OF THEM? At the same time? And why are you waiting to charge your car until it reaches 1% charge?)
What if you come back from a long trip and have a 10% battery remaining and then you recieve an emergency call and have to leave immediately and you can't because the 50-60km you have in your battery are not enough to reach your destination? (I can get to a quick charge station and get 200km in 15mins or so? The world is not ending? And if it's THAT urgent then I should be calling an ambulance anyway, because I probably need one)
I don't want an automatic car! I love changing my gear! (Thank fuck I got rid of the clutch and the gears... never been happier when I drive!)
Ah... but the speed, the torque of a thermic sports car... (Dude, you can't afford a sports car, what the thell are you talking about? And even if I can't either and I have a pretty average EV, you should just press the accelerator of an EV to the bottom and see for yourself)
But it's all about the feeling... the sound... (oh, I get it now... you want to "feel powerful" making everyone look at you and your noise making machine... yeah, I can't compete there, and I don't even want to anyway)
But the electricity is made by burning fuel! (Most of it comes from green sources and, anyway, what the hell do you think your car run on? Water? Are you not very intelligent?)
But the lithium comes from child labor!! (Says while casually using their iPhone, wearing clothes made in a third world country...)

After this, they usually proceed to make absurd claims like "I don't care, I just don't trust EVs.

[–] blauergrashalm@feddit.org 5 points 49 minutes ago (2 children)

My reason for not buying an EV: it's still a fucking car. Bit less shit, but still shit.

That should be Number 1 Reason to not buy an EV!

[–] Allero@lemmy.today 4 points 30 minutes ago

Agreed! EVs are certainly superior to ICE cars, but they're a band aid instead of a solution.

Bring back public transit!

[–] MalReynolds@slrpnk.net 1 points 8 minutes ago

I mean, technically, an eBike is an Electric Vehicle, and not a fucking car. Otherwise, hard agree.

[–] MousePotatoDoesStuff@lemmy.world 1 points 11 minutes ago

I wonder how many of those would not apply to hybrid cars.

Also, for 8: Making car go by burning fuel in a big optimised plant is likely more efficient than doing it in an engine that has to fit inside the car.

[–] Electricd@lemmybefree.net 2 points 59 minutes ago

For a lot of people it’s number 7 and I mean, that’s sad

1 is real though, and it can be a pain

There’s also the case where some areas are isolated and there’s no charger nearby and that can be a pain, and yea, that’s not a good spot to be in

Finally, if you can’t charge at home, you’re not really going to save on electricity price compared to fuel, so that’s not the best purchase, and it might be a pain to charge frequently outside if you have an cheap car that charges slowly

[–] Tja@programming.dev 18 points 3 hours ago (3 children)

Very much similar to my own experience. The blackout is the funniest, because gas stations don't work in a blackout, while solar panels do (assuming you disconnect them from the grid).

I would add one:

But I couldn't drive 1.000km without stopping (how often do you do that? It doesn't seem safe anyway....)

[–] Demdaru@lemmy.world 1 points 45 minutes ago

gas stations don't work in a blackout,

...do US statioms not have their own generators?

[–] AbsolutelyNotAVelociraptor@piefed.social 9 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

Oh, yeah! I forgot that one!

When you ask them how many times they found themselves with a thermic car doing 1000km without stopping they usually tell you: never, but what if I had to?

Bitch, if you need to do 1000km without stopping, you should be taking a train or a plane. Driving 10-12 hours without a single stop is bad and dangerous.

[–] jqubed@lemmy.world 2 points 2 hours ago

This was something I realized when we drive to my wife’s parents. It’s 2,000 km each way from our house in the US to where they are in rural Quebec, Canada and we usually drive it twice a year. The charging times sound long, but even with our petrol car most of our stops end up being between 15 to 30 minutes anyways between fueling the car, taking the dog to grass, taking turns going to the toilet so the dog isn’t alone in the car, getting food and giving me a chance to eat so I’m not trying to drive and eat at the same time.

I think the real challenge of electric range anxiety is that it still takes planning, at least in some parts of the US. There are areas on our route where it might be 100 kilometers to the next fast charger, and there’s no guarantee that all of them will be working or compatible with a car’s fastest charging speeds. We don’t really have to think about where we’ll get gasoline; there’s pretty much always a station, often several, within the next few miles. Usually if we’re waiting to stop for fuel it’s because we’re looking for the best price, looking for a place that might have decent toilets, and/or might have an appealing food option along with the gasoline. That’s all manageable in electric but might need some advanced planning, and many American drivers aren’t used to doing that kind of route planning in advance anymore.

How many cars in Europe can drive 1,000 km without stopping anyways? The only ones I can think of offhand are large American pickup trucks intended for towing large trailers long distances. I wouldn’t expect to see them in Europe.

[–] elvith@feddit.org 3 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

The only somewhat valid use case for "driving 1.000km without a stop" would be several people in the car taking turns on the driver's seat. While you'd technically need to stop to switch drivers this in itself is way quicker than even a quick charge on paper.

BUT: considering traffic jams, speed limits and such - a 1.000km trip would take around 10+ hours anyway. You're not going to tell me that you do not even stop to pee or stretch a bit for 10+ hours, do you?

[–] ArmoredThirteen@lemmy.zip 1 points 39 minutes ago

While growing up my family once a year would take a 20 hour car trip to visit extended family for a couple weeks then 20 hours back. Parents would do five hour shifts and get the whole thing done in one go. Shift changes meant refuel, bathroom, that's it. Other than that there was no stopping unless it was a "the next bump in the road I will 100% shit myself" kind of an emergency

Now personally I'd argue maybe we shouldn't have been taking road trips in that manner because it's like putting your body through a meat grinder. But if trips like that are someone's goal I doubt there are many charging stations in the middle of absolutely nowhere that can fully charge an EV in the time it takes to pee. I'm hoping though maybe a shift to EVs will change the way people approach long road trips to actually force them to take breaks

[–] Jolteon@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 hour ago

My argument: When I can get a decent used EV for $5k, I'll do it. Until then, I'll just get a decent used ICE car for $5K.

[–] pineapplelover@lemmy.dbzer0.com 16 points 3 hours ago

Another point to add for 9, all the EV parts can be recycled. The metal body is recycled in to new cars and battery components are also recycled in to new batteries.

Relevant technology connections video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtQ9nt2ZeGM

[–] bdonvr@thelemmy.club 6 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

Blackout

Eh? What if there's a gas supply issue? Can't fuel up. I've experienced this after a natural disaster disrupted gas deliveries. Lines for blocks. Days to wait.

[–] purplemonkeymad@programming.dev 5 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

Not to mention what if someone does something silly like start a war and push the price of oil up. Solar does not increase in price after it's made.

[–] Ziglin@lemmy.world 1 points 1 hour ago

Doesn't mean they can't raise it :>

[–] Ziglin@lemmy.world 2 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

I feel like some of those points are slightly more valid in rural areas (especially in the US, where a power pole being knocked over means that the power is out for hours) where the people making those points are more likely to have grown up. Then again if you are not in a rural point of the united states you are less likely to need a car.

[–] llii@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

If I lived in rural US where the power is not guaranteed I would install PV and use my car as a power backup.

[–] Ziglin@lemmy.world 1 points 20 minutes ago

That sounds rather expensive (if PV is photovoltaic). And I was not aware that cars were built to supply power like that.

[–] Successful_Try543@feddit.org 4 points 3 hours ago

What if there's a blackout in the whole city and you can't charge your car?

They couldn't refuel their ice car either or how do they think the fuel is made to flow "uphill" from the tank in the ground into their car.

[–] trxxruraxvr@lemmy.world 4 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

My reason: the hybrid I have is still working fine and a new car and a new car won't be in my budget for the next 10 years or so. Also iirc about 33% of the energy a typical car will ever use is spend on its production, so it's better for the environment to use a car until it breaks down.

[–] AbsolutelyNotAVelociraptor@piefed.social 3 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

that's completely fine. If your car works, you shouldn't throw it away, that is wasteful.

[–] Electricd@lemmybefree.net 1 points 50 minutes ago (1 children)

Depends on the car. Waste of resources sure, but it can reduce emissions depending on the car

[–] Successful_Try543@feddit.org 2 points 30 minutes ago

Unless their car is scrapped, this only results in another car being on the road.

[–] Demdaru@lemmy.world 0 points 30 minutes ago* (last edited 29 minutes ago)

My arguments against EV, not sorted by anything:

It's comfy to feel and hear working engine.
I really dislike automatic gearbox. It feels as if I lost part of control over vehicle and I kinda need it to not go autopilot. Like, me going autopilot, not car.
EV's seem best for richer people than me living in houses where they can charge them up - charging from station still can be pricer than gasoline.
I can have emergency gas can in the car and if something happen, it will buy me enough range to reach another station. And when I turn off ICE car, it won't leak it's fuel, no matter the temps. The last part I will write up at the end.
Where I live, the EV infrastructure is catching fast but it is still really lackluster, and to add to that, even I can feel like 70% safe with infastructure here, it's not certain for my neighbouring countries so that also limit.

And about 4:

This winter we had a small funny problem that two TIRs decided to play overtake on a frozen road and crashed, blockimg whole road. People spent 12 hours standing in line and not really able to get out from what I heard. ICE cars once turned off in that scenario would not give a frick about temps, but wouldn't EVs have problems with their battery discharginf either due to cold or due to fighting the cold?

But all in all, I still would like EV car lol. In my use case - that is either driving in my hometown or driving to the next bigger city over, they make a lot of sense. Although I can't afford any car anyway xD

[–] romanticremedy@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

Huge depreciation and not enough range. Probably wait till next battery revolution and it becomes cheaper than ICE

[–] AbsolutelyNotAVelociraptor@piefed.social 4 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

Depreciation is pointless if you plan to keep your car until it breaks. The range is mostly an excuse that people use to justify they don't want an EV. Most cars today have at least 400km range and fast charge that's quick enough to give you a good range from a 15 min stop. Nobody should be driving 1000km non-stop as they claim they'll be (and which is the main reason they use to talk about the range).

[–] Electricd@lemmybefree.net 4 points 48 minutes ago

Those cars are really expensive compared to entry level ones, which clearly don’t have fast charging nor big capacity

[–] Tudsamfa@lemmy.world 8 points 4 hours ago (2 children)

I will get an EV when the range/charge speed will allow me to make it 7 miles in 24 hours. And maybe if they're small enough to fit in a passenger train.

[–] NoSpotOfGround@lemmy.world 12 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

I think you want a donkey.

[–] elvith@feddit.org 2 points 1 hour ago

Also I want it to be rechargeable with hay bales! ...wait

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

You know electric motor assisted bicycles exist, right?

[–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 3 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

So do donkeys

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago) (1 children)

Yes, but recharging those is messier and requires extra steps.

Plus I'm pretty sure that they'd be greeted with little enthusiasm on most passenger trains 😄

[–] TexasDrunk@lemmy.world 2 points 16 minutes ago (1 children)

Oh come on, most people like a little ass.

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 minute ago

Sure, but donkeys big enough to ride aren't exactly little 😁

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