How come one side apparently MUST remain nonviolent but not the other
this post was submitted on 17 Oct 2025
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Because of propaganda and state power. It’s not a symmetrical conflict.
It certainly isn't
They don't have to, but data shows over and over that non violent ones more often end to being more successful at regime change.
Benefits for the non violent:
- more people are willing to join protests
- much harder to use force to squash protesters (they can still try, but that often motivates more people to join, that is what for example happened in Euromaidan)
- it is much harder to frame that those protesters are there to hurt ordinary people
- sends signal for good people in power to do the right thing and that we have their back
- validates people that they aren't alone and that it is a lot of us
We actually have more power than them, they only succeed if we get scared and think there's nothing we can do. It becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.
I've seen many statements to that effect. I have not seen political science studies that support it though.
Not much history to support it either.
It's a little more nuanced.
Violent resistance tends to swap one regime for another.
Non-violent resistance tends to create more positive social change.
If the only goal is to get rid of Trump, either one can work. If the goal is to have a brighter future then a revolution with minimal violence is preferable.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S2452292924000365
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Solidarity movement in Poland was a peaceful protest and last to end of the communism there.
Color revolution (including orange revolution in Ukraine)
Euromaidan (it was peaceful, although the government wasn't).
Statistically peaceful protests succeed 53% of the violent ones succeed 26%
Note though it isn't just showing up one day and be done, it's about having a sustained protest with at least 3.5% of population involved.
Basically, if we start shooting, that will result in a military response, and the US military is really good at massacres.
"Give me liberty or give me 40 more years of wage slaving consumerism and hoping my demographic isn't next"
Not sure if you are aware but the military are already responding
They are fucking begging for violence to break out so they can start a massacre. They're doing some heinous shit. It can get infinitely worse.
Has to be better than letting them slowly boil the frogs
What we want is to create a broad understanding of popular support for antifascism so that the military takes the side of the people. A huge public rally is part of that
Im aware. The Guard did in a few Republican-controlled places last time too. But what they did was stand around instead of massacring the crowds. And that's a good place to bem
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Just look how stupid the administration is sending troops to Portland because all of the "violence". If Portland was more violent then they could carry the narrative rather than people dressed up in costumes. People will remember the frogs and the absurdity of the situation.
Both should, one does. Don't sink to their level.
“When they go low we go high” got us Donald Trump
If your country doesn't sink to their level soon you won't have the right to protest them any longer
Until when? The world wars are clear evidence that eventually violence is the correct response.
Where's the line?
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Some months ago I was giving a coworker shit for not doing much of anything. No protests. No volunteering. No donations. Just works his mid six figure job, plays video games, and dates his works-at-google girlfriend. He admitted maybe he could do more. I said I could nag him the next time a big protest happened. He said sure.
Well, I messaged him with a quote from that conversation. He was like "oh it's Saturday?" And then no further responses until I followed up a day later. He's not going to do anything.
The other guys from that group also don't do anything.
Something about rich white straight (-passing) men comfortably just keeping their heads down and not even doing a half assed minimum bothers me.
But I guess there's nothing to be done. I'll be doing my best.
Get a woman in the group to invite spouses and girlfriends. The men will mostly follow.
A handful will decide they like cybertrucks more than sex
Interesting idea. I know at least one of them is dating a Google employee who, from what I can tell, is rather "apolitical". I don't know about the others, though.
I'm not calling for violence, none at all, but peaceful protests like these that one day are and the next day aren't are just ignored.
At the very least make it a protest that bever stops. Every day people are on the streets. Block the streets, whatever it takes, within a non violent protest, to get their attention and keep it
Abolitionist movements, women's suffrage movements, and civil rights movements were all successful non-violent resistance movements.
What did violent resistance movements achieve other than getting a bunch of people killed? Oh right sometimes the leaders of violent resistance movements get power and there is the 100% predictable result of putting violent people into power.
On the internet there's always some foreign troll farm whispering "burn down your own capital" in everyone's ears all of the time in every country they don't like. But it's stupid to listen to them, their motives aren't to improve anything for you, they just want to create chaos.
Violent resistances don't accomplish anything. Non-violent resistances have accomplished a lot if you actually study history instead of listening to the troll farms.
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Yep, for these things to matter there has to be no end in sight until those that want the change get heard and taken seriously.
Bonus points if they are headed up by sympathetic and visible politicians and/or other public figures. A well spoken orator in the vein of MLK at a podium giving a loud united voice to these sorts of movements are what creates something non-violent that is really hard for those in power or those on the side lines that would otherwise support the movement to sweep it under the rug as a one off.
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Yes.
Now get out there.
I'll be there tomorrow with the frog guys!
Fuck yeah they do, see you there comrades
They typically lead to more political involvement
Only because people have started to become affected personally by government policies. Many of those who voted for Trump regret are also in No Kings protest.
I'll happily welcome anybody who flips because they recognize how awful Republican policy is. That's important if we are going to have a durable majority
Republican policy has always been awful but these people thought it will only affect certain groups until they got affected.
The biggest win is getting more people involved and comfortable with protesting and non compliance. Today was the largest single day protest in American history and up 40% from No Kings I.
You can't go from zero to prolonged protests over night. Each event needs to build on the last with increased experience and new participation.
Yes you can, but Americans aren't willing.
"we're experts, we studied administrations where the government was comprised of people that gave at least 1/3 of a fuck what the population thought so naturally my opinion can be applied to an administration that gives absolutely no fucks whatsoever about the population."
They care enough that they're trying to talk it down. Having a big chunk of the population turn out to tell off a dictator is a key step in how they lose power
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I'd love for protests to have wins, someone teaches what they are.
What i see: politicians fervently getting in photo op moments vs fixing this cluster fuck w living in. I swear every dem wants to get arrested for the gram....while I actually need them to unify on voting agendas.
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See you out there folks!
Wasn't that long ago in the evolutionary timeline that humans diverged from sheep. For safety reasons we still want to be part of the biggest flock. Seeing huge numbers of people at protests stirs something in our DNA.
Um yes, what kind of stupid question is that?
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