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Nah I'm all for the converts. They're very useful in persuading others. It's a wasted opportunity to just burn them and in essence tell anyone that they will be punished for changing their minds.
Yeah, I'm for converts, but not MTG. You don't get to come back from "Jewish space lasers started the forest fires". Every day people, sure. But she was an instrumental part of putting the bitch in office a second time. She doesn't get a pass now that she's conveniently "reformed" after leaving her position of power.
Ohhhhhhhmygod, this is such a very important point that gets so lost on the terminally online crowd. The political opportunity of such a high profile member of a major party leaving said party is insane. You would have to be all the way outside your mind to not take the opportunity to poke the cracks forming in the two party system. MTG bad, yep, not disagreeing, but it would be just straight stupid to not pick this up as a way to get more conservatives to start questioning the republican party and in turn the two party system as a whole.
It would be stupid, a lot of people are . . .well maybe not fully stupid but deeply blinded by their emotions. Unfortunately politics has evolved into like religion2.0, infidels are to be slaughtered, and anyone who doubts anything whatsoever is to be crucified. I remember when it wasn't like this, when there wasn't this intense pressure about switching parties. Of course it always existed to some degree, but from what I've seen and what I know it's been ramping up the past decade or two.
We elected a black man and it broke the brain of every conservative in America. That's why it's seemed to ramp up over the last two decades.
Definitely part of it but I think it's deeper than that. Let me put on my paranoid hat real quick. A ramp up of division is useful to the rich and powerful, particularly if it turns into a culture war, which of course it has.
Calm down Kamala.
I agree. Splitting the GOP into Nazis and “I just want to fuck over brown people” is actually going to be great for them not being able to get a vote majority in our broken electoral system.
Also sometimes they switch completely, personally if someone wants to improve, if only a little I try to encourage it. If immediately they're met with hostility for improving then the only sensible direction for them to go is back. At the end of the day and as you pointed out in your comment, it's a numbers game. You can try to divide and conquer and also recruit. Defectors / converts are extremely useful at convincing more to convert which definitely won't happen if at the front door we're telling them to fuck off and suck a bag of dicks. So if people go against their poor judgements I'm all for it, one step closer to waking up, switching sides and adding to the numbers.
Fuck yeah, you're on a goddamn roll. The best way to fight your enemies is to turn them into friends. The best way to fight racists is to get them to no longer be racist. Best way to fight nazis is to get them to not be a nazi. Etc. If you don't give them any opportunity to reform, then why the fuck would you expect them to change??? Normalize the fuck out of the above attitude.
It's all pretty well outlined in the art of war and the 48 laws of power but as I like to put it, the war is never over until your enemy becomes your friend.
On the other hand it teaches them that there are no consequences for their actions. And sure, if it's about a personal acquaintance going through issues I'm all for it but we are not talking about people looking to change their ways- they're still the same bigoted fascists that they were before, they're just shopping around for another Klan chapter to join because this one didn't pay well enough. That's not people you want to associate with, I'm getting Coriolanus vibes. Careful who you bring into your fold.
I'm more so after the people she will influence. If it's signaled to them that changing their views is a bad idea then they are less likely to. Also I'm not looking for miracles, cracks and division in the party are also useful.
There have absolutely been consequences for their actions. Its just that people dont get "what they deserve" they just get what they get. The universe doesnt balance automatically for your idea of morals. Us humans are special cause we can enact consequences that the universe didnt. Hopefully we get there for them but that will be on those that can when we can. This isnt the time for getting lost to it.
But she’s not a convert. She continued voting with her party, but is leaving office. Her actions and rebranding are in order to transition to the talk show circuit. If offered the more money elsewhere, she will become a malignant force once again.
She’s an opportunist, not reformed. An opportunist with a microphone and a pension.
If you can't get a convert you can get someone who will create division. Not as good, but still worthwhile. Individuals play their parts and then leave, the truth is nearly everyone is playing to their own self interest so that should always be expected. Acts of wellbeing or charity typically come when someone is already fed and taken care of. I can't say anything about what will be but what is there now is still useful. Also I am speaking somewhat about her case and more so generally.
I’m seeing less chink in the armor and more a false quisling or a fox in the henhouse. I give it 2 months before she starts peppering in careful dissent to pull people to the right.
Between her and Carlson, they're setting the stage for a party split. It's yet to be seen which faction will contain the most lunatics.
I hope they form another party - let's call it the Teabagger Party.
The Teabagger Party can be like the Reform Party, the Constitution Party, the Libertarian Party and draw away votes from the Republicans. In this case, they might have a bit more star power than some of those other crank parties and help split the vote of Republicans enough to radically weaken their stranglehold on the country I love.
Must be new to this game, every side has kooks and crazies, they're useful. Of course the right has swung pretty hard into that camp lately. Really driving their christo-facist state, but it backfired when they ditched their isolationist stance and of course blatantly disregarded the poor in their camp. We should keep accurate receipts about the affects of the Big Beautiful Bill to drive it home that their party is the anti-middle class party, the bourgeoisie party. Shit would be wide open to whoever can bring down the cost of living.
You don't know me.
Would be cool if we were like unknowingly long life friends or family members. Would make that comment really funny. Anyways, odds are I don't know you irl.
Nah. There are certain people that dont get a pass. I wouldnt piss on her if she was on fire and she gets no points for being the same self-serving rat she's always been.
Anyone that followers her away from this administration will likely follow her down whatever terrible thing she backs next.
Not to say I dislike justice but I'm a hippie, the one people one love, unconditional love, hope, and forgiveness as best I can manage type. I get where you're coming from, I wasn't always this way, used to be a pretty angry fellow. For me I'm more so sad to see minds and hearts that are so deep into ignorance that they cause needless and avoidable suffering to themselves and others. I like to see minds become aware because they stop causing needless and avoidable suffering. Of course that process of becoming aware can be quite hellish at times, which is why most don't bother. To me if it can be managed it's the ultimate punishment because on the other side you get a person who wants to decrease needless and avoidable suffering.
I also wouldnt really want to help put her out if she was on fire. But if she grabs a fire extinguisher and starts helping put out the raging world ending fire... I won't tell her to stop or push her away until it is out.
At least we know what she is doing for now
The thing is that what she is doing is holding up a prop fire extinguisher, to get a photo in the news. She still thinks and wants the same awful things.
Yeah? What has she been wanting?
Do you remember who she was and the causes she championed during her stint in office? That, minus trump or GOP. She remains the jewish space lasers lady.
Oh I was just asking cause you seemed like you had something more recent.
For sure. But im a soft hearted man and if I give her an inch I'll start to forget the miles bullshit she helped march us through to get here. The best I can do is silence, but when someone starts giving people like her any credit I get livid.
I believe that we can agree on somethings and disagree on others but still work together. MTG is not one of those people and I count myself lucky that I'm not in politics because I would pull my hair out with all the stone walling and theater that people like her have done over the last 3 decades.
There is no decorum or forgiveness for career politicians. I can count on one hand the ones I would trust enough to vote for again in any election.
I have a thought for how much a trust any politician.
And its that if they hear the government is full of corruption and back alley deals of no work or hard work and is excited about joining.
Well then they probably arent going to do much to actually make it better for me, compared to what they are thinking about for themself.
But hey, eventually got to do something about it and even if that means finding someone who doesnt want to burn alive even if it is selfish cause at least they might help.
This is more infighting than conversion.
Yeah but generally any movement away I encourage. Maybe they don't fully switch parties but still aids almost as well. Immediately reacting to any change of heart with hostility might decrease the division or prevent people from fully switching. I say give me your tired, your poor,Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,The wretched.
I was just being pedantic. Certainly we should all encourage the split, but I wouldn't count on any of them becoming allies anytime soon.
I've seen it happen on a personal level and seen individuals go the other way.