I disagree with the removal but you are wrong. Anti settler colonialism in Palestine use this argument of genetics and genealogical because those where exactly the main justification of Zionists forcing a state on the local Palestinians population. Many Zionists claim that they had has the right to create an ethnostate because of 2000 years old Jewish kingdom and continuous presence in the land while at the same time saying Palestinians are just Arab colonizers that should be transferred to other Arab countries while Israel take all the historical Palestine
Ye Power Trippin' Bastards
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So wouldn’t it make more sense to completely undermine this idea? Staking a similar claim makes it more debatable since both groups have at least superficially convincing historical narratives in play. And with anti-Palestinian racism being so commonplace in the west, people are biased towards Israeli narratives.
Whereas acknowledging that people always have a right to stay in their homeland just immediately undermines the exile and evictions involved in Israel’s colonialist project. It’s simple and easy to understand and directly rooted in basic human rights that everyone can empathize with.
No, we are not using the same type of argument to prove us right but to prove them wrong. There is people who really believe Zionists stupidest claims so yes it is important to use the same logic just to prove that the argument is so stupid and contradictory.
I just think by engaging in this argument you give it credence, and it’s such a confusing and technical one that most people aren’t going to understand or have the ability to debunk anything, so they’ll just go with their political affiliation.
I mean does the argument that European Jews have a claim to some distant land because some of their ancestors came from there hundreds to thousands of years ago really need to engaged with as a serious argument? I don’t think this really has much weight if you think about it.
Like, I have European ancestry. The implication here is I should be able to go back to those countries and kick someone out of their home just because of this fact? It’s a ridiculous and extremely violent idea. I think that’s going to be a lot easier to get people to see than quibbling about what percent of Jewish ancestors came from here or there.
I mean does the argument that European Jews have a claim to some distant land because some of their ancestors came from there hundreds to thousands of years ago really need to engaged with as a serious argument?
Considered the amount of time i see this argument on social media show that the argument is a serious argument from zionists so yeah i think it is important to adress it
Just look at the far right demonstration in the uk. They couldn't gather as much people few years ago despite the ideology they hold that no civilized people should accept them
Even a ridiculous theory like fat earth is gaining popularity, 2% of Americans believe in it that's 6 millions people
Eeegh, This is not a clear-cut subject. While yes, a lot of us believe that one's genes shouldn't determine where one is allowed to live, we also can't dismiss the fact that historically Europeans felt very justified in forcefully going and settling lands where other people already lived because they felt they should just do so, and in the process exterminating the indigenous people and cultures. It's a more nuanced discussion that can be done in a few sentences, but I don't think it deserves a ban.
we also can't dismiss the fact that historically Europeans felt very justified in forcefully going and settling lands where other people already lived because they felt they should just do so, and in the process exterminating the indigenous people and cultures. It's a more nuanced discussion that can be done in a few sentences, but I don't think it deserves a ban.
I wholeheartedly agree. But again: bringing genetics into this is racist-pilled.
Again, not clear cut like that, since the aggressive party is indeed very much a settler-colonial project.
I agree. But you can critizise them without arguing with genetics.
Depending on the motivation
The motivation is irrelevant if the result of that chain of thought is ethnopluralism.
https://lemmy.world/post/36586419
And MeanwhileOnGrad thanks to SmugJesus is using this as proof we're tankies, somehow.
But they don't brigade us! And Goat definitely isn't Pug's friend!
Yet another one for "anyone I disagree with is Tankie."
Nuance is apparently just a city in France. Love that monkey doing whataboutism in the comments, as if I said "only Europeans can do colonialism".
Also SmugJesus being an incredibly uncharitable pos to claim my words support "ethnic cleansing"
The person who is a known liar, and replies to db0 users knowing they can't read his posts is being wrong? Unheard of.
Do you feel the same about First Nations rights? About Ukrainians? Or does it just make you uncomfortable in the context of Palestinians? Are Indians from India? Or South Africans from South Africa? I fear you may have some implicit bias in play here.
One of the big false claims is that Palestinians are solely from the Arabian peninsula when that’s just unequivocally false. They’re indigenous to the Levant and it’s an important distinction to fight Zionist propoganda. Palestinians have the right to argue against being ethnically cleansed by stating their multigenerational ties to their home. Just like any First Nations people or other nationality. You’re concerned about weaponization of ethnonationalist rhetoric in a context where the power dynamics simply do not support such a concept.
Need to pick one: 'genetics' OR 'geneology' on this topic.
They're extensively different and blurring the two allows the discussion to pivot between them, which maximizes the potential for misconstruing points or taking them deliberately out of context.
You were right to call that trash out... these genetic clown discussions always end in one place lol
Funny how you got censored but person making the claims that would never fly in any other context did not. Not that i support censorship of either position. People should be able to discuss the issue freely.
Palestinians indigenous population to the land, I don't understand why genetic vector of argument is being used here at all beyond being dilatory on purpose.
I got banned on ML for calling American Jewish billionaires supporting Israel. bc NOT ALL JEWS 🤡
ML censorship has an interesting angle to it.
Genetics provide information about a population indigeneity
ok... now take this logic to the next step...
Palestinians are descendants of the Canaanites and never left the land, so they had the right to reject settler-colonial projects whose intention was to colonize all the land.
After the formation of a large army in the wake of the establishment of the state, we will abolish partition and expand to the whole of Palestine. – Ben Gurion
It is true that Jews are also descendants of the Canaanites. The difference is that most Zionists were foreign Jews who had lost connection to the land by living elsewhere for centuries. Those Zionists had no valid justification to impose a state on people who had lived in historic Palestine for centuries.
Using genetics and ancestry against Zionists to expose their hypocrisy and illogical arguments is both valid and important.
Only two most steps to a genocide!
