this post was submitted on 11 May 2026
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    alt textAn edit of xkcd 2501, "Average Familiarity":
    [Ponytail and Cueball are talking. Ponytail has her hand raised, palm up, towards Cueball.]
    Ponytail: Open-source alternatives are second nature to us foss nerds, so it's easy to forget that the average person probably only knows Linux and one or two degoogled Android ROMs.
    Cueball: And Firefox, of course.
    Ponytail: Of course.

    [Caption below the panel]
    Even when they're trying to compensate for it, experts in anything wildly overestimate the average person's familiarity with their field.

    partly inspired by the replies to this post but i see this kind of thing all the time (shoutout to the person who once genuinely asked "who still uses google these days?")

    made with this neat tool

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    [–] ferrule@sh.itjust.works 55 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (11 children)

    The other day my wife was talking about her new job and having to take notes. For the past 30 years I've been keeping notes in text, then markdown in vim, starting with personal scripts, then vimwiki. A coworker showed me Obsidian, which while not FLOSS, does use an open standard for all its files. It pretty much does what my setup does.

    Then it dawned on me that my wife and other non-techies just use whatever their computer has on it by default (i.e. OneNote). She never thought to go out and look for better productivity software. The idea that there is tons of better apps out there doesn't register. She has a phone, knows about the app store and gets tons of stuff there but as for her desktop or laptop the idea of apps outside of MS Office and the video games she plays is lost on her.

    [–] BigTwerp@feddit.uk 18 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (1 children)

    All my work computers are provided by the companies I work for and per their rules I can only take and store notes using their approved software and on their servers which basically means I work on a locked down Microsoft ecosystem. Access to third party productivity software is simply not possible outside of certain role specific specialist software.

    I would guess literally millions of employees have a similar setup so it's not that we are tech illiterate per say, but more accurately in the corporate world this option doesn't exist so there is no point trying.

    Outside work my productivity tools consist of a Moleskine notebook with tasteful check paper.

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    [–] rumba@lemmy.zip 20 points 6 days ago (3 children)

    They just want to get the job done. The fact that they considered a note-taking app at all isn't universally normal. To this day my wife sends me messages in signal as a post-it to remember things, she could have just sent it to herself, but she used to do the same in sms and just applied that forward after I convinced her security was a good step.

    We want the best, the nicest, the most useful thing. We apply the same rigor most non-technies use when choosing a car.

    They want to fill a need that, at worst, bothers them a little.

    [–] ferrule@sh.itjust.works 6 points 6 days ago (3 children)

    My wife did the same on signal. When I showed her the "Note to self" feature she was amazed an. started using it. She use to get annoyed that we would text and her note would get lost but now it doesn't.

    It isn't about finding the best, it is about finding better than the worst. My wife needs the features Obsidian has, she says she wished her notes would visually link together. What she doesn't know is that such apps exist.

    She wishes she could sync files between her phone and computer and not have to go to a website to get them. syncthing does that.

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    [–] sunstoned@lemmus.org 13 points 6 days ago (4 children)

    I feel obligated to mention Logseq here. It's similar to obsidian, but FLOSS (AGPL-v3).

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    [–] JackbyDev@programming.dev 6 points 6 days ago (1 children)

    Honestly OneNote is pretty good for the people who like it though. I personally really can't stand rich text editing, I really need a raw view. If I didn't have those reservations I'd probably like OneNote more.

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    [–] imetators@lemmy.dbzer0.com 25 points 6 days ago (5 children)

    Judging by how huge share of browser usage Firefox has, I am pretty sure vast majority of normies know nothing about Firefox

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    [–] Jaimesmith@lemmy.world 18 points 6 days ago (5 children)

    The β€œwho still uses Google?” crowd forgets most people just want their computer to work, not become a weekend side quest.

    [–] ricdeh@lemmy.world 8 points 6 days ago

    Nonsensical argument. Just because a piece of software is FLOSS and non-Google, it is not automatically a "weekend side quest". Big Tech is very happy that these false equivalencies have spread as well as they did, but they don't hold a kernel of truth, at least not anymore.

    [–] desertdruid@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 5 days ago (1 children)

    oh man it sures takes all my weekend to install firefox and set a search engine

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    [–] faintwhenfree@lemmus.org 3 points 6 days ago (8 children)

    I get the point, but going away from Google search is so easy.

    Gmail on the other hand I understand why people are still stuck using and I don't push them to switch away.

    But it drives me nuts that some normies in my life will complain that Google has gone worse, still refuse to switch. There are some who don't know how to change default and I still get it, but there is one mf at my work, he changed his default in edge from bing to Google and when I said since you know how to change default why not use DDG or startpage or honestly any other non giant alternative. He just says too much work.

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    [–] BennyTheExplorer@lemmy.world 2 points 5 days ago (1 children)

    Honestly, switching search engines is pretty normie friendly. I've got a lot of non-techy friends or family, that use Ecosia or something. They also did it on their own, I didn't even encourage them to do it.

    With things like Linux it's a bit harder. But if they don't rely on any specialized software, they are usually fine with me offering to upgrade their Laptops so Linux. I installed Linux Mint on my Mom's Laptop and she can use it as well as Windows. She never complained about it.

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    [–] phoenixz@lemmy.ca 7 points 5 days ago (3 children)

    I can never see any media hosted from files catbox.moe, am I the only one?

    [–] spoopy@lemmy.world 2 points 5 days ago

    Do you happen to live in Spain during a football game

    [–] Hypocrite9554@lemmy.world 2 points 5 days ago

    Looks like there's an outage at the moment

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    [–] sleet01@lemmy.ca 10 points 6 days ago

    Condescension means "patronizing attitude or behavior"; your comic doesn't show condescension so you probably need the dictionary definition spelled out.

    .../s

    That's why I try to show people I know how to get FOSS alternatives for their everyday apps. It takes a bit of patience but trust me when I say this: Most people are more tech savvy than you think, they just don't wanna go through a judging community.

    [–] mabeledo@lemmy.world 12 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

    Happens all the time. Also, nerds tend to overestimate the amount of resources, like time or money, someone would put on something they care about.

    Right here in Lemmy I had this interaction where someone argued that if one were to lose their photos because Google had an oopsie, it’s kind of their fault because they didn’t have a backup plan.

    [–] HrabiaVulpes@europe.pub 4 points 5 days ago

    Every group of nerds assumes average person knows more about their obsession...

    [–] Taleya@aussie.zone 11 points 6 days ago (4 children)

    I have had a comm literally dogpile me claiming linux wasn't designed for multi sessions or to run as a terminal server.

    My respect for lemmy foss forums is in the fucking toilet.

    [–] AllHailTheSheep@sh.itjust.works 12 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (2 children)

    there's a lot of people that hopped on the Linux train in the past few years. which is great, truly. but many of them don't understand where it came from or what it was originally designed to solve. particularly on lemmy, people are pretty up in arms about their opinions of Linux all the time, so I would bet whichever comm was doing that is mainly the new heads. again, love that it's getting mainstream recognition but I wish the combative attitude was at least tabled until they actually understand it.

    the recent debate of systemd in here kind of drove home that a lot of people just parrot points without having their own thought out opinions.

    [–] Taleya@aussie.zone 10 points 6 days ago

    Oh let's be honest, elitism has always been baked into linux a bit. Remember the old joke about how to get help on a linux comm? Ask and get told to RTFM even if you detail a complex issue that demonstrates you have in fact read tf m. Say "linux sucks because you can't do X or Y like you can in windows" and they fall over themselves.....

    But yeah, the new batch of users are just...you want to gently grab them by the face and say "you're not fucking nero hacking the matrix because a command line interface doesn't make you shit your pants any more my dude. Stop acting like it."

    [–] Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (2 children)

    As soon as a kind of Tech starts getting fanboys, you start getting ignorant bollocks about it, not just from the fanboys but also from the kind of people that, just as emotionally, set themselves against the fanboys not because of any understanding of the weaknesses of the Tech itself but purelly as a psychological need to set themselves against the fanboys.

    Linux used to have a huge barrier to entry - for example, you used to literally have to understand how CRTs worked in order to configure X and get it running - which kept the fanboyism down and the few whose like for it went all the way into fanboyisms were at least technically savvy so mainly understood what they were talking about, but nowadays the "quality" of fanboys is closer to the level of game, celebrity or or political fanboys - people highly emotionally engaged that don't have any in depth understanding and are only "experts" on the highly visible superficial stuff.

    Anyways, all this to say that fanboyism, whilst being a bad way to relate to Tech (IMHO, and the same for people who set themselves against fanboys as just as mindless contrarians), does indicate to me that Linux is definitelly becoming established as mainstream rather than the OS for mainly server side experts and hobbyists that it was for decades.

    [–] ricdeh@lemmy.world 3 points 6 days ago

    What I find more disrespectful is people that join the greater community, but who have no appreciation for the giant amount of philosophical and political (on-top of the technical) work that was done to enable the relatively free/libre and open environment we have with Linux-based operating systems today. I find it so sad that GNU haters have successfully established divisive memes such as the Stallman GNU/Linux copypasta. We owe so much to the GNU project and GPL license, and I think we would be in a much worse place today if Linux had not been licensed under the GPL. I am fundamentally opposed to people who try to move the distributions into a less free direction. Some may see this as elitism, but this opposition is not born out of a desire to dominate or humiliate anyone, but rather to protect the many great achievements of the FLOSS movement.

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    [–] prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 6 days ago

    My experience with the Linux communities here has been the opposite. Very welcoming, and very helpful.

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    [–] arcine@jlai.lu 9 points 6 days ago (6 children)

    Okay but litterally everyone knows about Firefox.

    I'm willing to concede some people don't know about Linux. But I've never met anyone who didn't know about Firefox.

    [–] NightmareQueenJune@lemmy.world 20 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (3 children)

    No. People who are 30+ maybe. But there are tons of people in GenZ (my generation) and Alpha that don't even know what folders or ~~symlinks~~ Edit: shortcuts are. And Firefox is a nieche browser since 10 years or so.

    [–] calcopiritus@lemmy.world 13 points 6 days ago (5 children)

    Putting folders and symlinks in the same category is wild. Most people I know (basically every non-elderly non-toddler person) knows what a folder is. Yet only some of the programmers I know know what a symlink is. Not even a chance for non-programers.

    At most they'll know what a shortcut is. Which is not the same as a symlink.

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    [–] Decq@lemmy.world 18 points 6 days ago (1 children)

    Hah no they don't. My partner doesn't even really know what a browser is, or where the distinction between phone/pc and 'the internet' lies. Sure she might have heard of the word 'firefox' but no way she can explain what it is or does.

    [–] adarza@lemmy.ca 12 points 6 days ago (4 children)

    that's the true 'average' person. they don't know. they don't understand. they don't even want to know. they just use this magic thing that shows stuff from the internet. they don't even know what a bookmark is, they just 'google' for everything. even google, ffs.

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    [–] PerogiBoi@lemmy.ca 12 points 6 days ago (1 children)

    The vast majority of people I work with in my organization have absolutely no idea what Firefox is or that there are other browsers. You, me, and everyone here is living in a bubble.

    [–] calcopiritus@lemmy.world 6 points 6 days ago (2 children)

    Not too long ago, in the internet explorer era, Firefox had a huge market share. Something like 30%. Even if they didn't use it themselves, they probably knew someone that did.

    They may not remember it, but at some point they knew.

    They may say they don't know firefox, but if you ask them "do you remember there were some people that didn't use internet explorer before chrome?" They'll probably remember, even if they don't remember the name.

    [–] AlpacaChariot@lemmy.world 6 points 6 days ago

    There are quite a lot of people in the workforce now who are so young they won't remember that!

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    [–] irelephant@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 6 days ago

    "Why does your google look like that"

    [–] lambipapp@lemmy.world 13 points 6 days ago

    Everyone uses VLC still right? ... Right?

    [–] pineapplelover@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 6 days ago (1 children)

    I wouldn't be surprised if gen alpha hasn't heard if it because schools primarily use Chromebooks and the only browser is chrome

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