To be fair, housecats don't always kill for food. Sometimes it's just... because they can, and have insticts to hunt.
Humans have plenty of food sins too, of course.
this post was submitted on 23 Apr 2026
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Like extreme food waste
Like not just on a personal level either, but like industrial scale food wastage
Humans are aware and awful
the chicken are raised in a streamlined process sothat the land area usage is used to produce the maximum amount of birds
meanwhile wild birts are wildly inefficient with their food so eating 1 wild bird consumes waaay more land area than eating 1 industrially farmed bird.
Not sure the killed bird cares about your land area usage statistics
not sure i care about what the killed birds think of me.
apart from that, read my comment with a hint of sarcasm
Cats really shouldnβt be in a position to get birds in the first place. Statistically, cats that are allowed to go outside live a shorter amount of time than indoor cats. Not to mention how devastating it is to the local bird population.
Ecosystem did kinda progress around long-living cats in regions like Egypt and Turkey tbf. But yeah it took a thousand years and some bird/mouse species probably went extinct during that process.
This is a good read: https://www.kinship.com/uk/cat-lifestyle/outdoor-cats-uk
As a result of this intrinsic desire and innate survival ability, 70% of domestic cats in the UK live an indoor/outdoor hybrid lifestyle, with charities such as Cats Protection and Battersea actively recommending that cats have access to the great outdoors for their well-being (much like us needing our little daily walks for our mental health). Zoe explains that because cats are solitary survivors, they learn using both observational learning and trial and error, and when they have the opportunity to try something new and gain a positive outcome (like jumping over a garden fence), they remember that experience and adapt accordingly. βSo with this in mind, allowing a cat to free roam could lead to a favourable outcome for their emotional and physical wellbeing,β she says.
In contrast, in the US, 70% of cats are kept indoors, or if they are let outside, itβs within the confines of a secure garden or catio (this is also for their well-being, but for different reasons, which weβll get into later). Or take the town of Walldorf in Germany as an example, which previously had a fine in place of up to β¬500 for cat parents letting their cat outside, due to the risk of death to the endangered ground-nesting crested lark β and those cat parents could even risk being fined up to β¬50,000 if their cat injured or killed one of the birds.
sigh Americans, man... always the contrarians. First 1776, now this.
EDIT: Jokes aside, this article is quite comprehensive, and every time I see people arguing about this online - and that's oddly frequent - I wish they'd read this article first. Cause fact of the matter is it's different for every cat owner. If you're letting your cat outdoors in central New York or some desert that's full of coyotes, you're wrong. If you're not letting your cat out where I'm at (rural, no predators) you're wrong. Generally speaking, it's actually stunning how quickly most online arguments end once you add context to them.
EDIT 2: I am not even fucking kidding, if any of you downvote this before reading that article you are literally what's wrong with the internet. Do it. Read it. This must end, dammit. The outdoor vs indoor cat thing must END. I am tired. The flesh AND the mind ARE BOTH WEAK.
The BBC link is broken.
The others are both US based. What did I just say above?
Yeah, it's totally just an American issue. I'm sure all the flightless birds in New Zealand that evolved without such predators are happy to have cats wandering outdoors. /s
Are you from New Zealand or are you also American?
EDIT: Here, this is New Zealand - https://www.companionanimals.nz/articles/new-research-sheds-light-on-kiwi-attitudes-to-outdoor-access-for-cats
Are you one of the few cat owners in New Zealand who don't want their cats outdoors? Is that who I'm talking to? Else I'm not gonna bother.
What do people's attitudes have to do with facts? Your own link says:
In NZ, free-roaming cats primarily prey on small mammals and birds, creating ecological concerns, although cats may also control introduced pest species. The impact of cats on the environment, along with community nuisance and potential zoonotic risks, have prompted calls for national cat management policies. Public support exists for such policies, though translating this into behavioural change remains challenging.
Cats themselves are an introduced species in many parts of the world. Many island animals in particular haven't evolved for a hunter like them. People's attitudes toward what to do with cats doesn't change the fact that they threaten wildlife, which even your own links acknowledge.
Not sure what my country of origin or status of cat ownership has to do with any of that. I don't need to be anywhere special or have a cat to understand the ecological damage they can cause.
This article seems questionable at best. Not only is it specific to the UK but it stops citing sources and having links as it gets down into the you should decide for yourself whether your cat kills too many birds part. As far as I can tell it also makes no mention of the problems of cat fights or the diseases that cats can get from catching wild birds. Not to mention FIV or rabies, both of which had spread in my old neighborhood and some of the neighborhood cats had to be put down for it.
Cite me your high-quality research then.
FUUUUUUUUCK. I'm putting on a pot of coffee. Looks like I'll be here all night. This is the 1000th fucking time I have this fucking argument. It's just impossible with these people (Americans, in this case? I suppose? That was the case on Bluesky). Their heads are so deeply shoved up their own asses. They just have to be fucking right about everything. No matter how lightly and politely you go into this argument it just immediately turns into bullshit and shaming and pompous crap. Trap your fucking cat in your house in whatever swamp filled with alligators you live in and shut the fuck up. How hard is it to understand that different places in the world have different situations and rules?
Holy fuck we should just all not have cats so everybody shuts the fuck up, I swear to christ... It's like discussing religion
EDIT: Actually no, fuck this, I am not doing this again. I am leaving with this: would you rather live 100 years safely trapped in your house or live a normal 50 years? And now I'll leave before someone gives me some "Well actually I like being indoors, I love my booooks and my moooovies and my snaaaacks" and makes my eyes roll back into my skull.
Downvote the fuck away. I know this whole-ass site is US-dominated. At least I'm calm enough to not forget cultural differences are a thing. I don't give a fuck anymore. I'll go outside and pet the strays and ferals I shelter that I didn't buy from a fucking cat factory to keep as a toy like most of y'all judgemental asses. Literally the reason I even have cats is cause other people treated them like shit in the first place. Total fucking crap. Nobody has shit on me. Enjoy your president, geniuses.
EDIT 2: Oh and one more fucking thing. If you live in a place that's unsafe to keep a cat or has endangered bird species, the solution is not to SELFISHLY get a cat anyway and keep it indoors. It's to NOT HAVE A CAT. That has been my opinion before I ever even had a cat. I did not have a cat in the city. I adopted ferals on a farm. This SELFISHNESS is why "indoor extremists" exist in the first place. You shouldn't have a cat in the first place. This is why your view on this issue is exasperating and lacks nuance.
You know I think they might have a point... Having an "indoor cat" seems cruel, unless you live in a biodome.
Normally Iβd tell you to go fuck yourself. But cats deserve better than your ignorance. So here you go.
Fuck you, asshole. I'm blocking you.
Bye Felicia!
crazy take that cats shouldn't go outside because that's bad for them when that's literally what they're made for
Statistically, humans that are allowed to go outside probably live a shorter amount of time than indoor humans too, if they are otherwise taken care of just as well.
What statistics? Incarceration shortens life expectancy.
Idk, people who don't go outside usually are less active and healthy, get less vitamin D and dont socialize as much (generally).
I am now realizing i missed "if they are otherwise taken care of just as well", which invalidates my whole argument lol
I mean, there were those simulated Mars missions and biodomes they did. Now Iβm super curious what counts as a βindoor humanβ, and exactly how long one could live inside one of those biodomes.
That's Antarctica for half the year.
They're not our prisoners. Let them live their instincts a little!
βIβm gonna level with you, cat, that bird was shit compared to mine.β
I never blame the cat. I always blame the owner. Keep your beautiful damned cats indoors!
I used to be afraid if my indoor would not be able to survive if something happened to me and I would not be able to take care of her nor would she be able to fend for herself.
She got out one day and came back the day after with a dead bird so whatever I guess.
As long as you don't declaw your cat I see no reason why they couldn't hunt and survive. I only see their ignorance of more deadly animals as a problem. Cats are only semi-domesticated, unlike dogs. Look no further than how they play and how they treat mice that wander in their domain.
Me: you'd better eat it, I don't want it.
Mmmm bird is tasty!