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concentration camps and millions being stripped of health insurance and food assistance
So like Gaza?
Because I'm pretty sure this was the logic for people who refused to vote that this very community spent an entire year assuring me was a bunch of tankie bots from ml.
There were a million reasons that people didn't show for Harris. Why do you scold only the people who were outspoken against genocide? Can you point to any evidence that this issue swung the election?
Biden put Harris in a terrible position by holding out as long as he did. Then Harris ran a horrendous campaign. That is why she lost.
People who care about Gaza are people who are politically engaged. That not who stayed home. Politically engaged people vote third party when they want to protest, and third party votes did not sway this election. Not even close.
People who stay home are normies who have given up. A lot of people need inspiration to show up, and centrist Democrats just aren't inspiring.
I can only suppose that your fixation on the genocide issue is because you like the genocide and were pissed off that people objected to it. That's the only reason to bring this trash up in every damn conversation about the Trump administration.
The majority of people who didn't vote for Harris don't care about Gaza. They're just larping on the internet.
She wasn't a zionist and wanted to end the war. It was a clear cut decision, but it was a brown and black sacrifice people were willing to make for their moral purity.
I was ready to demand my Lefty comrades go vote for Kamala: after all, one Genocide is better than two genocides.
But then she came out "tough on the border" and took that from me. She promised to be every bit as hard as Trump.
https://theweek.com/politics/kamala-harris-immigration-policy-mexico-border
But she worked HARD to alienate the Left. She took every piece of rhetoric I had and shat on it.
So we have Kamala caving on Gaza with rhetoric (and walking it back)
But flatly refusing to do anything:
Just like the Liberal Party. Promise almost nothing, make a symbolic gesture, do actually nothing.
https://www.commondreams.org/news/harris-gaza
So when she gets no support, why are Clinton Neoliberal, Reaganomics-poisoned-but-polite Liberals surprised? This is the Country they designed, on purpose.
She wasn't a zionist and wanted to end the war
Citation? Because any time I saw anything indicating that, she IMMEDIATELY walked it back. And I've cited (shitty) sources.
It is possible for her to be a bad candidate who made consistently bad decisions, and for it still to be a bad choice for an individual to not vote for her.
source: *gestures in all directions *
100% I have voted in every primary until this one bc it was canceled. I still voted for her even though I hated it bc the reality is/was that, of the two choices, she was not the worst.
The time for moral grandstanding is always long past when it’s Election Day.
100% real. I had the same reasoning. I'm just mad she didn't let me bring more people with me.
The time for moral grandstanding is always long past when it’s Election Day.
Good line. And good reasoning before that!
I have voted third party in the distant past. It’s not some awful taboo to not play along with the two party system. And given my extended family, the further back I look in the past the more that right wing stuff just seemed normal, so I may not make the same choice now.
But the time to abstain or go third party is when the price of expressing my more ideal choice is worth not voting against the worse of the 2-party candidates.
I guess the logical exception to that is if you’re an accelerationist and you think we are SO far beyond being able to course correct that it is literally a more moral and humane outcome to turn the nu-neo-nazis loose on just about every vulnerable demographic that exists. Then you get to the rebuild phase faster and there’s less time for the government to kill & ruin people. But you never know if your plan is going to hit a little roadblock called nuclear armageddon.
Again, third party votes did not remotely sway the 2024 election. Blaming protest voters for your candidate’s anemic performance just reeks of entitlement.
Accelerationism is how we got Israel holding an abnormal amount of power for a country their size / economic importance.
trump still worse.
No thought comment?
I can do that too.
(Voted for her too, btw, I'm mad her rhetoric didn't let me bring friends)
I dug through my comment history to find this. It has plenty of links.
I read it. Democrats will keep playing the left for fools and moving to the right, no matter what happens.
No Bernie's campaign and Warren's campaign drove Biden to the left on a whole host of issues, including labor unions.
There was no daylight between her and Biden on Netanyahu’s genocide.
Don't lie.
This comment said it best and lists calls for a ceasefire from Harris.
https://lemmy.world/comment/13069715
She’s taken a stance, multiple times. The left doesn’t want to hear it.
March - https://www.npr.org/2024/03/04/1234822836/kamala-harris-benny-gantz-gaza-cease-fire-israel-hamas
July - https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/25/harris-netanyahu-israel-cease-fire-00171315
Harris promised to do everything in her power to end the war in Gaza.
“This year has been difficult, given the scale of death and destruction in Gaza and given the civilian casualties and displacement in Lebanon, it is devastating. And as president, I will do everything in my power to end the war in Gaza, to bring home the hostages, end the suffering in Gaza, ensure Israel is secure, and ensure the Palestinian people can realise their right to dignity, freedom, security and self-determination,” Harris said to applause during a rally in East Lansing city of Michigan, home to 200,000 Arab Americans.
Unlike Biden, Harris was not a life long Zionist.
When Joe Biden met with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his war cabinet during his visit to Israel, the U.S. president assured them: “I don’t believe you have to be a Jew to be a Zionist, and I am a Zionist.”
Harris wasn't perfect. And that was simply not good enough for some people who didn't want to risk their hands getting dirty. Even if it meant the Palestinians becoming the cost of doing business.
I voted for Harris and the election is over. That doesn’t mean I’m going to pretend that she wasn’t as committed to Netanyahu’s genocide as Biden was.
Good for you. I appreciate it. No need to spread propaganda though.
Saying that Israel has a right to exist is Zionist.
Thank you for the well reasoned response.
Here is my Issue:
When the Harris campaign did nothing to add teeth to the promise of a ceasefire (such as cutting off the weapons for the genocide would have done)? It comes off as just another empty gesture.
"Ben, stop the fighting! I mean it! we really need this to stop! I mean it!"
Only in the final final week before the election did I find any hope of cutting off weapons shipments. I had to dig, I had to scrounge, I had to be plugged in all day, every day, and trust political tabloids to maybe have it right this time, even as they referenced hints and leaked memos that the reader just had to trust existed.
Evidence was sparse, hard to find, and hard to trust.
Meanwhile, the sale of Palestinian Land https://wagingnonviolence.org/2025/01/activists-infiltrate-israeli-events-selling-palestinian-land-in-us/ Continues unabated. We see the incentive even beyond the "manifest destiny" style ideology, we see material gain for Israel to continue as long as ammo will last.
And rather than break from Joe, she wanted to be seen as AIPAC as honoring his commitments. She had a long history of supporting Israel. Publicly. Loudly. Even as that foreign-state's lobby backed people far to her right in both parties. https://theintercept.com/2024/10/24/aipac-spending-congress-elections-israel/
This information was widely available. Easily accessible. Why would I trust someone who wants AIPAC campaign money to share my values when I don't even see her articulating them in any meaningful way?
There was no daylight between her and Biden on Netanyahu’s genocide.
Don't lie.
You may have missed the "No daylight, kid." thing it seems.
She promised to be every bit as hard as Trump.
Bullshit. Biden deported more than Trump. But it wasn't news because he did it legally. Everyone got due process. There were no foreign prisons for the mass deportations. The problem with Trump isn't the deportation but his illegal methods.
The problem with Trump isn't the deportation but his illegal methods.
To a Liberal? Sure. One minute court hearings under Obama were technically "due process". https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/speed-over-fairness-deportation-under-obama
I care about my neighbors, not some piece of paper.
For a long time, Democrats have been polite Republicans, and I'm tired of pretending otherwise.
Its all just more authoritarian propaganda man. They're either mentally deficient or brainwashed at this point.
Way to unpack your slurs, maaan.
Anarchist here to tell you Obama turned deportation hearings into drive-thru ceremonies instead of actual justice:
https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/speed-over-fairness-deportation-under-obama
I see stuff like this and laugh. It would seem that most Americans, Democrats in particular, cling to the notion that they will have a chance to vote again. If there are midterms or another full election, they will be rigged the same as Russia, North Korea or any other "strongman" dictatorship. Keyboard warriors won't make a whit of difference.
It's one of the only things we have left to do so we better hope it makes a difference.
The right never gets any shit for using their key boards to advocate for murdering us all and it seems pretty effective for them.
I’m definitely taking a dump on that bitch Virginia Fox’s grave when she dies and you know it’ll be soon cuz she’s an elderly, geriatric, expiring, old bitch.
BUT WAIT, THERE IS MORE!
You voted though, right? For Harris? That’s the only correct answer.
Non voters + Trump voters + Jill Stein voters brought us into this mess. I haven’t heard anything from Jill Stein, as a leader I hope she’s speaking out too to her base. ~~
I used the ballot box and voted straight blue, yes.
Really looking like it’s time for the next box and I hate that but no nazi deserves to breathe