this post was submitted on 24 May 2025
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[–] aidan@lemmy.world 2 points 58 minutes ago (1 children)
[–] theologynerd@lemm.ee 3 points 32 minutes ago (1 children)
[–] aidan@lemmy.world 1 points 24 minutes ago

Somewhat yeah, but I think there are a few others, just mostly not people who are that vocal about it

[–] Phegan@lemmy.world 15 points 2 hours ago (3 children)

I just want people to have food, shelter and healthcare at an affordable price.

[–] Katana314@lemmy.world 6 points 56 minutes ago

Some call this “Leftist extremism”. =/

[–] CtrlAltDefeat@sh.itjust.works 1 points 21 minutes ago

Like .. all people?

[–] Prior_Industry@lemmy.world 2 points 1 hour ago

Seems reasonable.

[–] NeilBru@lemmy.world 11 points 3 hours ago (2 children)

Anti-Conservative

There is no such thing as liberalism — or progressivism, etc.

There is only conservatism. No other political philosophy actually exists; by the political analogue of Gresham’s Law, conservatism has driven every other idea out of circulation.

There might be, and should be, anti-conservatism; but it does not yet exist. What would it be? In order to answer that question, it is necessary and sufficient to characterize conservatism. Fortunately, this can be done very concisely.

Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit:

There must be in-groups whom the law protectes but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.

There is nothing more or else to it, and there never has been, in any place or time.

For millenia, conservatism had no name, because no other model of polity had ever been proposed. “The king can do no wrong.” In practice, this immunity was always extended to the king’s friends, however fungible a group they might have been. Today, we still have the king’s friends even where there is no king (dictator, etc.). Another way to look at this is that the king is a faction, rather than an individual.

As the core proposition of conservatism is indefensible if stated baldly, it has always been surrounded by an elaborate backwash of pseudophilosophy, amounting over time to millions of pages. All such is axiomatically dishonest and undeserving of serious scrutiny. Today, the accelerating de-education of humanity has reached a point where the market for pseudophilosophy is vanishing; it is, as The Kids Say These Days, tl;dr . All that is left is the core proposition itself — backed up, no longer by misdirection and sophistry, but by violence.

So this tells us what anti-conservatism must be: the proposition that the law cannot protect anyone unless it binds everyone, and cannot bind anyone unless it protects everyone.

Then the appearance arises that the task is to map “liberalism”, or “progressivism”, or “socialism”, or whatever-the-fuck-kind-of-stupid-noise-ism, onto the core proposition of anti-conservatism.

No, it a’n’t. The task is to throw all those things on the exact same burn pile as the collected works of all the apologists for conservatism, and start fresh. The core proposition of anti-conservatism requires no supplementation and no exegesis. It is as sufficient as it is necessary. What you see is what you get:

The law cannot protect anyone unless it binds everyone; and it cannot bind anyone unless it protects everyone.

Also, those who insist on political purity tests reveal themselves to be temporarily-inconvenienced-dictators-in-waiting.

[–] Tartas1995@discuss.tchncs.de 6 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

While I am totally in the "bind all and protect all" camp and really against the "in group protect, out group rules" and I think conservatism is often in practice "protect me and rule others", I am not sure if I agree with it being called conservatism.

I think fundamentally the hierarchy in right wing politics imply an in/out group. But just like conservatism is a form of right wing political views, so you could argue that the hierarchical political views are a Form of "in group protect, out group bind".

Whatever you want to call it, is part of conservatism, I believe. But I don't like to call it conservatism, so it feels like we are defining two related but different things with the same name, which will be confusing and could be used by e.g. "progressive" capitalists to claim that they aren't conservative and therefore not "in group protect, out group bind".

[–] NeilBru@lemmy.world 1 points 59 minutes ago* (last edited 58 minutes ago) (1 children)

I am not sure if I agree with it being called conservatism.

Yes, Wilhoit, if I'm understanding his treatise correctly, addressed this point:

For millenia, conservatism had no name, because no other model of polity had ever been proposed. “The king can do no wrong.” In practice, this immunity was always extended to the king’s friends, however fungible a group they might have been. Today, we still have the king’s friends even where there is no king (dictator, etc.). Another way to look at this is that the king is a faction, rather than an individual.

The corollary label could be "Anti-Establishment". Perhaps, "Anti-Authoritarian".

[–] Tartas1995@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 50 minutes ago (1 children)

I don't know what the best term is, but I fairly certain conservatism is probably one of the worst. I think tribalism and anti-tribalism would be a better starting point while that was a meaning already too.

[–] NeilBru@lemmy.world 1 points 28 minutes ago (1 children)

I think tribalism and anti-tribalism would be a better starting point while that was a meaning already too.

On this, I agree.

However, I propose that the "Anti-Conservative" label, with all of its flaws, has more utility in presenting its economic and political implications within the admittedly linguistically absurd political discourse in my country (U.S.A.).

[–] Tartas1995@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 8 minutes ago

I think, there, we have a disagreement. To me, it would sound like you reject the republicans specifically in a us political discussion, a position that I wouldn't be interested exploring, because of how strong the tribalism in us politics is. I would just assume that you are supporting the democrats. While with the understanding of the conversation, I would assume you aren't supportive of any of the us political party and vote for the least bad option.

In other words, I wouldn't want to explore your political position if you use that term as I would assume I understood. Consequently I would misunderstand your position. And I think others would do the same.

If someone would identify as a conservative, they wouldn't take you seriously anymore, as they would understand it that you reject them, even tho in practice they would agree with you on a lot of stuff and you aren't necessarily rejecting them.

[–] BlackRoseAmongThorns@slrpnk.net 4 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

Also, those who insist on political purity tests reveal themselves to be temporarily-inconvenienced-dictators-in-waiting.

I hope this isn't about leftists refusing to support biden/kamala in the US.

[–] TronBronson@lemmy.world 5 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago)

You didn’t have to support them. You just had to use your brain and choose the lesser of two evils. Like which one of these people is more likely to illegally deport me for exercising my first amendment rights? I think you’ll find the answer to that question soon.

[–] Kickforce@lemmy.wtf 16 points 4 hours ago

The kind that got chucked off reddit for being mean to Trump, Musk and Netanyahu.

[–] febra@lemmy.world 0 points 1 hour ago (1 children)
[–] vga@sopuli.xyz 2 points 1 hour ago

Have you tried like not being one

[–] Adulated_Aspersion@lemmy.world 19 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

Get your finger out of the trigger guard.

[–] aidan@lemmy.world 1 points 22 minutes ago* (last edited 22 minutes ago)

To be fair, if you saw the movie, he was definitely ready to pull that trigger within the next milliseconds. But yeah shouldn't be pointing in the air without any trigger discipline

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