this post was submitted on 09 Jul 2026
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[–] Murse@slrpnk.net 14 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Back when I was a wee little shit, and the parents were ritualistically sacrificing my Sunday mornings to Sky Daddy & Super-J by dragging my ass to church: I recall our pastor actually addressing this. Idr the verse he referenced, but it boiled down your 'soul' or some shit being driven to god even if you haven't been exposed to him here on Earth. TLDR, even if you don't know, you still go to hell for being a dirty heathen, so good 'ol christians have a duty to go shove their shit down as many throats as possible to 'save' them.

Whether or not that's true to their lore, I have no idea - there are so many contradictions in that shit that you can basically make it say whatever you want.

[–] bus_factor@lemmy.world 7 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

In my experience, each flavor of Christianity handles this a little differently. IIRC the reason the Mormons are extra aggressive about hounding your door is because they consider it an obligation to spread the good word, while there are other groups who just stay out of your business entirely.

WRT the quote, there's very little talk of heaven and hell at all in Lutheran churches in my experience, just as an example. Although I have only been exposed to the Norwegian state church, which is pretty laid back about most things, so your mileage may vary with other Lutheran churches.

[–] tempest@lemmy.ca 4 points 3 hours ago (2 children)

I thought Mormons were like a pyramid scheme. Only the top 300k Mormons get be be God of their own planet so they have to get more in so they can be at the top.

[–] Doomsider@lemmy.world 2 points 45 minutes ago

No, you are thinking of Jehovah Witnesses. Mormons definitely want all their members to go to the temple to be sealed to ensure their future right to rule their own planet.

https://www.equip.org/perspectives/jehovahs-witnesses-and-the-destination-of-saved-humanity-who-are-the-144000-witnesses/

[–] BloodMuffin@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 hours ago

Mormonism is truly insane. it's a super interesting rabbit hole to investigate.

[–] nightmare786@leminal.space 47 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago) (6 children)
[–] stickyprimer@lemmy.world 1 points 41 minutes ago

Indeed - as a writer I find holy texts fascinating for their endurance through viral properties. It seems important for them to speak at once with ultimate authority but also a lot of vagueness to keep the messages versatile for as many situations as possible and as unfalsifiable as possible.

They are the equivalent of a radioactive meteor that lands on an unwitting planet and spreads a plague.

[–] 0x0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 4 hours ago (2 children)

That is hilarious. They gave Christianity the selfish-gene treatment. I'll be embarrassed if this is a page from the book — I haven't actually read it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Selfish_Gene

[–] nightmare786@leminal.space 2 points 2 hours ago

It's from The Meme Machine by Susan Blackmore

[–] updn@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

That's exactly what I thought of when I read the post, but don't recall this page being in The Selfish Gene. Worth a read, though! (Better than this trope).

Edit: Apparently from Susan Blackmore's book, The Meme Machine.

[–] hoshikarakitaridia@lemmy.world 2 points 3 hours ago (2 children)

This kind of implies that this is the social engineering equivalent of worm-like malware in Cybersecurity.

That's curious.

[–] stickyprimer@lemmy.world 1 points 39 minutes ago

High replication and changeability to adapt to circumstances. From molecules to lifeforms to cultures. It’s all the same process.

[–] BloodMuffin@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

or a physical virus

[–] BitchPeas@lemmy.world 8 points 6 hours ago

Preach brother

[–] cheat700000007@lemmy.world 1 points 4 hours ago

Original chain email

[–] untorquer@quokk.au 5 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

Should have kept it in Latin...

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

Nah, should have kept the original speeches or whatever in Aramaic and never written them down.

Organized religion is a vestigial organ from more primitive eras that's weighing humanity down.

[–] WanderingThoughts@europe.pub 3 points 4 hours ago

Not only religion. Any institution or organization, no matter what reason it was created, will immediately put continued existence and growth as their first priority.

[–] ceenote@lemmy.world 59 points 8 hours ago (2 children)

The actual answer is "I don't know, the Bible doesn't say."

The contradictions between doctrine and the Bible make so much more sense when you view it in the historical context of a tribal religion, as it was written, not as some kind of universal truth. The Bible doesn't say what happens to people who never hear about it because the writers weren't thinking about that.

[–] Zarobi@aussie.zone 0 points 1 hour ago

I always believed that God would accept anyone, even if they don't believe, as long as they were good people. I can't imagine He would just turn away the kindest people because they were born on the other side of the planet. But I don't get along with fundamentalists.

[–] Bishma@discuss.tchncs.de 15 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago) (1 children)

Mathew 18:18 is the circuit breaker for those situations: whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven

AKA when in doubt, god defers to the Pope for some reason.

[–] ceenote@lemmy.world 13 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 6 hours ago) (1 children)

The evolution seemed to be Old Testament = God of Israel, New Testament = God of the Jews and Gentiles, but they still clearly weren't thinking about people in distant lands like the Chinese or Mesoamericans.

I think that any religions that have survived to the present day did so in part because they contained flexibilities like "defer to the Pope"

[–] Bishma@discuss.tchncs.de 8 points 6 hours ago

From a religion maintenance POV it makes total sense. From a "god is omniscient and infallible" standpoint, it makes my head hurt.

[–] TigerAce@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

"eskimo" is a curse word for Inuit, meaning raw meat eater. Please stop use that word, it's disrespectful.

[–] Murse@slrpnk.net 26 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago) (3 children)

Spent some time in Alaska - the natives I had a chance to speak to referred to themselves as Eskimos. And it wasn't one of those 'we can say it, but it's derogatory coming from anyone else' words... it's just a word they use for their people. They were kind of amused at the whole controversy.

It's anecdote, and the number of them actually offended by the term Eskimo is probably higher than zero, but by and large this is white people being offended on their behalf at something that is a non-issue.

So, call em Eskimos. Or Inuit. Or Natives. From the source, they're cool with it.

[–] iocase@lemmy.zip 5 points 3 hours ago

Ummmm, actually, it's Eskimx

[–] cheat700000007@lemmy.world 10 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Latinx is still the dumbest thing I've heard

[–] Murse@slrpnk.net 3 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

While I do get wanting to steer the language away from pointlessly gendering everything (why tf do I need to know if my blender is a boy or girl??) ...yeah "Latinx" ain't it.

To me it always reads phonetically like "lah-teenks". I hate it.

[–] Derpenheim@lemmy.zip 6 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

Except the desire to degender everything is a specifically English endeavor, and only because it doesn't have gender based nouns. Spanish is VERY MUCH A GENDERED LANGUAGE. Also, Spanish already HAS a neutral article, "Lo" so not even using that while inventing our own bullshit is the most pearl clutching nonsense I've ever seen

[–] iocase@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 hour ago

Its literally a fools errand. Especially since most people speak languages that are strongly gendered. It's just a self-absorbed virtue signal. The people who made Latinx obviously never stopped to ask most Latin people what they thought of the whole endeavour... And no, I don't mean Francis your half Mexican schoolmate from private school...

[–] nialv7@lemmy.world 1 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)

but also Eskimo and Inuit refer to different things.. Inuit people is one part of Eskimo

[–] How_do_I_computah@lemmy.world 13 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago) (1 children)

It really is a good question. This situation is referenced to in Romans 2.

Romans 2:12-16 ESV [12] For all who have sinned without the law will also perish without the law, and all who have sinned under the law will be judged by the law. [13] For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law who will be justified. [14] For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. [15] They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them [16] on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus.

So, the answer is still "I don't know if you are. I don't know if you're doing the right thing by your law or conscience."

As for "Why tell me?" The theory is still that it is better for your life to know and that God's law is better and more generous than man's law.

[–] BloodMuffin@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

great answer, thanks for that. i wonder if apostates/non-believers are included in "Gentiles who do not have the law"

or is it only the people that never heard the gospel?

[–] How_do_I_computah@lemmy.world 2 points 2 hours ago

I can't say for sure. Nobody really can but there is a divide in some protestant faiths that someone "once saved is always saved.". Meaning that if you ever believed then you're good to go. I think this idea is rooted in John 10:28-29 ESV [28] I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. [29] My Father, who has given them to me,is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.

A lot of Christian faiths don't agree with that logic though.

I think largely though people believe Romans 2 only applies to people who have never heard.

[–] SalamiDommie@lemmus.org -4 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

In other things that never happened.

[–] toxicbubble@lemmy.world 11 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

except christian missionaries have been literally doing this for thousands of years

[–] SalamiDommie@lemmus.org -5 points 2 hours ago (2 children)

You mean every belief system?

[–] Kolanaki@pawb.social 6 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago)

I ain't ever seen Jews or Muslims or Buddhists or Taoists or believers of Shinto, or anything else going door to door telling people about their prophets. Just Christians and occasionally Scientologists.

[–] surewhynotlem@lemmy.world 10 points 2 hours ago

Nope, sure don't.

Unless you've had The Satanic Temple murdering your ancestors for not believing and I somehow missed it?