Ask Lemmy

More of a rant than a genuine question. Locking.

Give us an example what you’re referring to…your comment doesn’t mean a lot of without any context.

“Freedom of speech” is a fraught concept. Freedom of speech doesn’t mean one must accept the views of another, for example. Freedom of speech is also accepting reaction to your speech. Each speaker is “owed” whatever freedom you’re proposing.

People seem to be much more passionate about their stances here. Even when their stance is completely ridiculous and not rooted in reality. I've only blocked one person so far though (something I've REALLY tried not to do) and I've had a ton of good dialoge. You also can't really express any view that isn't far left.

Now this is some S-tier trolling, the kind of thing that could've incited a weeks-long flame war back in the Usenet days. The key here is the lack of any specifics, so each reader can interpret the issue differently by filling in the details from their own experiences. And it's framed so that either I agree that Lemmy users have bad attitudes, or I disagree and prove it. *chef's kiss*

This is the thing I like least about Lemmy. So many people have no friends or life experience, hate everyone, and want to constantly argue or insult others that it's difficult to avoid them. I block as many as I can, but it takes a lot of the fun out of meeting people and having discussions.

I'm all for letting people say what they want, but that goes both ways in letting them criticize what you say.

If you don't like them, you can just ignore them. Nobody is saying you have to take the opinions of people on the internet seriously.

I don't come here for friendly debate or to enrich my worldview. It happens from time to time but there are two many bad faith actors to waste time debating with people that don't already largely align with my priorities and morality.

Within those boundaries I'm happy to rethink things and have nuanced conversations and debate with people I already can largely agree on foundational thinking. But frankly at this point in my life if someone comes on here with "but what if Trump is good," I block. Like in order to get to that point, there has to be extremely little common ground to agree on. There is no hope of reasonable conversation.

Likely some people feel the same about me.

I've seen the opposite. I've enjoyed conversation's here and people generally have good facts to back up their point. There's a few assholes but way less than reddit. I'm worried it will get worse though.

What have you found is not being tolerated?

its there. I have seen it. its also not there. use the block. make the experience you want.

Apparently we believe in freedom of speech—so long as the speech is something we agree with….

As already mentioned, it's not exclusive to Lemmy/the Fediverse and then, thx to the Fediverse itself, we still can resist:

• the most important thing is that we're not into some centralized platform whose owner can easily shut out anyone. Banning is still a thing obviously (I regularly hear about admin abusing their power) but one always has the ability to change instance or even to create their own which i is not even an option, say, on Reddit or X.
• Freedom of expression should not mean one should be required to listen to trash ideas. Here again, the Fediverse/Lemmy/Piefed already offers great tools to filter out what and who one doesn't want to hear... without limiting their freedom of expression. Meaning that I, for example, am not forced to see the huge amount of low quality posts that are posted (politics and most memes, stuff like that) and that I can also easily block anyone I consider a pain in the butt or that is trying to troll me. Which I do without any hesitation and without ever threatening their own freedom to express themselves. Something I find a lot more friendly to freedom: theirs as well as mine ;)

The issue runs much deeper as, for most people, it seems to not be enough to be able to mute/block someone or some content they disagree with. They want it to vanish for anyone else too. The most... excited even want their author to be removed from the community. So they like to campaign for ban, or worse.

But here again, it's a much wider issue than with the Fediverse.

It's people not being educated anymore to tolerate divergence of opinions and, a lot more worryingly imho, not being able, because of that lack of proper education, to listen to nuanced thoughts and ideas and to be able to understand that we can disagree without having to hate on one another. They seem to live in a black or white world, populated with two groups of people: friends, those that are liking the same things and the same ideas they do, and foes, those who dare not like one or more of those things and ideas the 'friends' like.

As long as that 'logic' is not challenged and put back in its place (trash reasoning) the intolerance to what is different, which hating on one's values and ideals is, won't go away. Around here, like everywhere else.

I'm going to struggle writing this because the logic is so hard to follow but db0 blocked my whole (GERMAN) instance because my (again, GERMAN) instance moderates against hate-speech against Jews, making us Zionist fascists, somehow.

https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/63525728

Look carefully at the modlogs in the screenshots and understand db0 admins think that it's the feddit.org mods that are in the wrong for removing the hateful comments. It took me several minutes to comprehend that the screenshots were supposed to be proof that Feddit.org people are Zionists, because the mods are removing hate-speech. The screenshots are NOT proof of hatespeech on Feddit against Palestinian people.

In the eyes of db0, the GERMAN INSTANCE IS EVIL because it doesn't platform enough anti-semitism.

The ANARCHIST instance is mad at the GERMAN INSTANCE for not allowing hateful rhetoric of Jewish people.

Apparently we believe in freedom of speech—so long as the speech is something we agree with....

Freedom of speech isn't freedom from response. Some people have shitty opinions, and are too fragile to accept that people don't like them or their opinions.

And some people get upset when other people don't like AI and don't want it to do everything for them.

I don't think this is specific to lemmy. We generally like to hear people agree with us, and social media allows us to a) find spaces with like-minded people b) block people we don't like from interacting with us

We put ourselves into echo chambers where our assumptions and opinions are never challenged. You might talk about people with different opinions, but rarely to them. Live in that environment long enough, and you stop to question your convictions, and become increasingly incapable of articulating why you hold them, or to consider the perspective of 'the opponent'.

Freedom of speech doesn't mean a guaranteed audience or platform.

You can write whatever you want. No one is required to read it. No one is required to host it. If they do read it, they can say whatever they want about it.

This is the fediverse. You can host your own instance and say whatever you want. No one else is required to federate with you.

If you post something and people say it's garbage, that's not your freedom of speech being quashed. You spoke. Now they are using their freedom of speech in response.