this post was submitted on 11 Apr 2025
222 points (90.2% liked)

Linux

9674 readers
133 users here now

Welcome to c/linux!

Welcome to our thriving Linux community! Whether you're a seasoned Linux enthusiast or just starting your journey, we're excited to have you here. Explore, learn, and collaborate with like-minded individuals who share a passion for open-source software and the endless possibilities it offers. Together, let's dive into the world of Linux and embrace the power of freedom, customization, and innovation. Enjoy your stay and feel free to join the vibrant discussions that await you!

Rules:

  1. Stay on topic: Posts and discussions should be related to Linux, open source software, and related technologies.

  2. Be respectful: Treat fellow community members with respect and courtesy.

  3. Quality over quantity: Share informative and thought-provoking content.

  4. No spam or self-promotion: Avoid excessive self-promotion or spamming.

  5. No NSFW adult content

  6. Follow general lemmy guidelines.

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

Stumbled across this quick post recently and thought it was a really good tale and worth sharing.


A couple of weeks ago, I saw a tweet asking: "If Linux is so good, why aren't more people using it?" And it's a fair question! It intuitively rings true until you give it a moment's consideration. Linux is even free, so what's stopping mass adoption, if it's actually better? My response:

  • If exercising is so healthy, why don't more people do it?
  • If reading is so educational, why don't more people do it?
  • If junk food is so bad for you, why do so many people eat it?

The world is full of free invitations to self-improvement that are ignored by most people most of the time. Putting it crudely, it's easier to be fat and ignorant in a world of cheap, empty calories than it is to be fit and informed. It's hard to resist the temptation of minimal effort.

And Linux isn't minimal effort. It's an operating system that demands more of you than does the commercial offerings from Microsoft and Apple. Thus, it serves as a dojo for understanding computers better. With a sensei who keeps demanding you figure problems out on your own in order to learn and level up.

Now I totally understand why most computer users aren't interested in an intellectual workout when all they want to do is browse the web or use an app. They're not looking to become a black belt in computing fundamentals.

But programmers are different. Or ought to be different. They're like firefighters. Fitness isn't the purpose of firefighting, but a prerequisite. You're a better firefighter when you have the stamina and strength to carry people out of a burning building on your shoulders than if you do not. So most firefighters work to be fit in order to serve that mission.

That's why I'd love to see more developers take another look at Linux. Such that they may develop better proficiency in the basic katas of the internet. Such that they aren't scared to connect a computer to the internet without the cover of a cloud.

Besides, if you're able to figure out how to setup a modern build pipeline for JavaScript or even correctly configure IAM for AWS, you already have all the stamina you need for the Linux journey. Think about giving it another try. Not because it is easy, but because it is worth it.

(page 2) 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 17 points 2 days ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (12 children)

The UIs and UXes in Linux are still shit and look like they are from 1998. Engineers are not great designers. I design UI and UX for windows and Android for a living. I'm not professionally educated in design, but I know how to make a GUI look like it wasn't a collab by Mattel and M.C Esher for use on a museum computer. That goes for apps and system features. The Bluetooth device GUI in Linux Mint is fuckawful:

Being able to consistently install things by downloading an exe from a website and just double click it is lacking.

The names of Linux software are also regularly dumb. Trying to be punny, clever, or cool. If it resized images, just call it Image Resized For Mint or something, not "Nautilus" or Nemo", they are forgettable and tell me nothing about the app "Uhh, it was something ocean themed, I think". (This is true of Windows apps as well, Audacity, Figma Director, and Irfanview, I'm looking at you)

Apps "forgetting" the last-used settings, inc last used save file path, or user config, is a common issue too. Out of the box, apps should remember last-used settings without having to be told.

Window focus interfering with key capture is an issue too. Use Flameshot (a screen capture app) to take a region screenshot of a right-click context menu in another app - you can't. Greenshots on windows does it fine.

I still persist with Mint, but the process is further from 'Seamless' than even windows 11, the shitshow it is.

Maybe I just hate all operating systems.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 day ago (5 children)

Being able to consistently install things by downloading an exe from a website and just double click it is lacking.

This is something I still have issues with. I've been running Mint on an old Mac mini for six or seven months now, and still have to think to remember what flavour of Linux it's based on when trying to install software.

Then there's the way it has software installed via the store, Flatpak, and the terminal, meaning I have multiple places that need software updates. And that doesn't necessarily cover OS updates.

Don't get me wrong, I like Mint, and I do enjoy the tinkering, but I kinda go by the "Could I put this on my mum's laptop without her having trouble?" rule, and the answer is no. It's close, but no.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago

KDE discover is one shop for all. You do update system, flatack, snap, addons and more with it. There is nothing to forget.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago

We have appimages too now

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (11 replies)
[–] [email protected] 110 points 2 days ago (4 children)

The reason is that Linux usually doesn't come preinstalled. I'm pretty sure at least 50% of the users wouldn't even notice they have Mint Cinnamon instead of Windows on their Laptops.

[–] [email protected] 40 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I'd crank that up to like 80% Linux users somehow always seem to overestimate how tech savvy most people are.

I'd say 50% of users can't tell you what an operating system is. maybe more. and ya'll expect those people to be able to CHOOSE a Linux distro and actually install it. no way. that's way way too much to ask of the average end user.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 30 points 2 days ago (3 children)

I’m 💯 sure at least 99% of steamdecks run the ootb steam Linux

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 day ago (2 children)

I know a guy running windows on a steam deck. Absolutely mad

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 17 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (6 children)

I don't use Linux. I'm here from /all. I last attempted Linux probably around 2006 or so. The biggest thing I remember was driver support being awful. I guess it's a lot better now?

My biggest hurdle to making the switch is that it takes effort. It's not because I'm lazy; it's because I don't see any need to put in effort. Because I already have an OS, and it works fine. I know that to some, particularly in this community, there are a lot of things about Windows to complain about, but the vast majority of users can't come up with a list of things that bothers them about their daily OS. If my computer already had Linux on it, I'd probably feel exactly the same way.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 day ago

I was a Windows user for around 30 years and loved it. But I got so frustrated with Windows that I switched. My computer didn't feel like I was the one in control of it anymore, and I hated that.

I'm very happy on Linux, now.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago

My first experience was from back then also. It is much easier today than it was back then. It drove me crazy around 2008 or whenever I was fiddling around with it but today I would say it is easier than windows if you have an open mind.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I just made this same basic point in response to another comment, but this is exactly right. It takes effort to learn anything new, and that effort isn’t always worth it to people. But that alone doesn’t make using Linux “hard.”

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 days ago (7 children)

Exactly, my wife struugles with tech. She hated windows and how it did unexpected things that made no sense. I put Linux on her computer, she doesn't bug me with complaints now since it operates the same every day.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago

I did the same thing for my wife. She lives almost exclusively in the browser. I put her on the same atomic OS I'm using, and for her the experience is pretty similar to her previous Chromebook.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 days ago (2 children)

And that’s all most people want from a computer, yet Windows always throws a curve ball at some point.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago

Yeah, the issues with Windows are mostly a ton of really small things. There aren't too many major issues that will force you to switch instantly, and no one of the small things will make you switch because it's easier to just deal with it and move in in that moment.

I can't even remember what it was that made me switch about two years ago. It was Windows ignoring a setting I changed before when it updated. It just got really frustrating how little they care about what I want my system to do/look like. They only care about what they want, but it's my machine! It all eventually pushed me over the edge, but most users aren't tracking that.

I'm pretty convinced that most users would have a better time with Linux now though. In particular, the package manager makes not dealing with individual application updates and running random executable you find online such a better experience. As long as people are using a distro that suits their requirements, and not one that requires a lot of manual effort, it functions better than Windows. It isn't Windows though, so they get annoyed that it doesn't function identically to that shitty system they're used to.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 days ago

Man, I wish the Windows-only shop I support as a sysadmin "just worked." I spend the majority of my time troubleshooting random Windows issues.

Driver issues, firmware issues, Teams breaking, Outlook breaking, SharePoint and OneDrive sync issues, Edge freezing/crashing, UI scaling issues, routine updates failing, random connectivity issues, random audio issues, printer issues...

I won't lie, my Linux computers have random issues too, but way less often than the Windows machines I have to support every day. And when I encounter the Linux issues, I actually can fix them in a way that is permanent almost always.

Windows on the other hand, I typically fix and then the same problem starts happening again a few months later after an update, or the only "fix" that works is restarting the computer several times in a row.

To be fair to the Windows defenders, Windows 11 has easily been the worst for this in my experience. Windows 10 was more stable, and Windows 7 was even better. XP had lots of random issues, but back then you could still get under the hood pretty easily and make Windows do what you wanted.

Every personal device I have runs Linux and has for several years. I removed Windows completely from my life thank God, and I can't imagine going back. I honestly would be more likely to stop using computers altogether before I went back to the horror show that is Windows/Microsoft.

[–] [email protected] 62 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (3 children)

And Linux isn't minimal effort. It's an operating system that demands more of you than does the commercial offerings from Microsoft and Apple. Thus, it serves as a dojo for understanding computers better. With a sensei who keeps demanding you figure problems out on your own in order to learn and level up.

Counterpoint: most people don't use Linux because the people that evangelize Linux talk about it like this.

I don't want to "level up," I want to accomplish my tasks. I'm trying to get shit done, not train for a fucking tournament.

[–] [email protected] 42 points 2 days ago (7 children)

I think people that talk like this overstate the difficulty of Linux. There are easy distros that won't trouble the average user.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 2 days ago (4 children)

I'm the laziest man on earth and I use Mint, way less hassle than windows for example. So if you have never used either, you can safely go with Mint IMO.

If you gave spent 20 years on windows, then it's another story.

load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 16 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (10 children)

Exactly this.

I'm a software dev and also a Linux user, but that doesn't mean I want to spend my precious time messing around with the OS trying to solve problems.

I see the operating system as a tool I use to accomplish the things I actually want to do, which is writing my code for my projects, just the same as I see a car as a tool to get me from point A to point B.

If Linux was complicated to set up, or always broken, or requiring constant work then I wouldn't use it, no more than I'd tolerate a car which is broken down and in the shop every other week. But fortunately, Linux is none of those things.

Modern Linux mostly "just works", and it's really counterproductive to talk about Linux like it's hard or you need to be a deeply invested techie to use it.

load more comments (10 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 days ago (1 children)

See...

The RTFM condescending, contemptuous attitude doesn't help.

A lot of us are not teens, or 20 somethings, and have other responsibilities and duties.

We just want the shit to "Just Work." We don't want to research why the last version upgrade broke the graphics driver, or why our printer doesn't work anymore, or any of that stuff.

Granted, the distros that try to fix this have advanced light years over the last actual 20 years, but it's still not good enough.

And yes, I have my "Compiled From Scratch Arch" membership card. Never again.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Have you tried driving without learning ?

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 2 days ago

Let them eat ads

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 days ago (1 children)

But most people do use Linux; Android is the most common OS, isn’t it?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 days ago

Also guess what the Internet has always run on? *Nix.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 2 days ago

Path of least resistance is at the electronics store and general support from marketed software. So lack of Linux hardware in stores and lack of well marketed software

20 years ago Apple at least had store presence and had their own software as major draws, Final Cut Pro, GarageBand people loved, and really as a brand MacBook's are/were fashionable

Linux is widespread in software development and data science. It's mainstream draw is still developing. Could be games. It could maybe someday be seen as the choice for content creators if the selection of media creation/editing continues to improve and have their Blender/Krita rise. Talking like Kdenlive, Ardour, GIMP, etc

load more comments
view more: ‹ prev next ›