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(Meta) Regular small questions thread (lemmy.world)

submitted 1 week ago by IndigoGollum@lemmy.world to c/linguistics@mander.xyz

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I think having a thread for small questions ("What's the IPA for this sound?", "How do you write an affricate tie?", etc.) that's pinned and replaced every week or two would be good.

Just looking at new posts here in this community, i mostly see links to news articles and i don't know if it would be appropriate to make a post for a small question with a simple but hard to find answer.

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[–] IndigoGollum@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

In case people misunderstand the title and start asking and answering small questions here, my question is does the IPA have a way of writing sounds made with the tongue rolled (not a trill)? For instance, sticking my tongue out rolled and making a voiced fricative that way gets me what sounds like a cross between /ð/ and /β/, and trying to say /a(sound)a/ comes out as [aw(sound)a].

[–] lvxferre@mander.xyz 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

No because IPA only has symbols for segments and articulations that are attested in at least one language, and odds are that no language out there uses tongue rolled consonants:

a lot of people can't articulate it, so the articulation is rather unstable if you think about the linguistic community as a whole
it takes considerable articulatory effort, and as you said it sounds a lot like other easier-to-pronounce sounds

For symbols for "odd" articulations like this you have a better chance checking extIPA (extended IPA). Originally it was intended for disordered speech, but often you see the symbols leaking even for descriptions of ordered speech. I couldn't find one for tongue rolling though.

[–] IndigoGollum@lemmy.world 2 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Oh well, guess i get to make up my own unofficial letters. Thanks.

[–] lvxferre@mander.xyz 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Conlang, right?

It's completely fine to do some ad hoc IPA extensions when describing your conlang, just make sure to clarify them in the conlang files - both for others and for your future self. Or even ditch IPA and use a different notation system, made at home - specially when your conspeakers don't have the same phonatory organs as humans would.