Riverside

joined 3 months ago
[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 4 points 3 months ago

I edited my comment and added the second paragraph, not your fault you didn't see it :)

Communism doesn't actually say anything about wanting everyone's income equal, I've only seen this claim by anticommunists before. Communists simply believe that people should earn according to their labor, and not according to the exploitation of others' labor. For example, the Soviet Union had widespread use of work quotas which, when exceeded, granted workers a higher wage. As an example, the Stakhanovite movement did wide promotion of work effectiveness and of rewarding exemplary workers, both through monetary and through social incentives.

I personally don't believe there's much place for capitalism at all, but that's a very deep ideological topic that's far beyond the scope of this post. If you're interested on discussing this, however, I'm very open to this topic!

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 0 points 3 months ago (9 children)

a world without rent entirely is a really stupid idea that only ever seems uttered and promoted by Tankies

Meanwhile, in the USSR, nobody owned housing privately, most housing was accessed through the work union, and was rented at about 3% of monthly costs. You clearly, CLEARLY haven't ever engaged with a Tankie (such as myself) on the topic of housing.

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 0 points 3 months ago

fair

market value

Choose one

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 7 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (3 children)

I’m renting it to a family of Ukrainian refugees. They basically pay off my mortgage

Holy fuck, my sides. How can you be this BLIND to reality? You fucking said yourself that you have A FAMILY OF WAR REFUGEES PAYING OFF YOUR MORTGAGE. In 30 years time, you'll own a house and those refugees will own what exactly?

For reference, when the war broke out I was a tenant in Germany. You know what I did? I HOUSED a Ukrainian refugee in MY OWN DAMN HOME for NO COST, because I'm not a piece of shit

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 5 points 3 months ago (9 children)

What's "a fair price"? 1% over production + maintenance costs is already exploitative, in the sense that rich people who can afford to buy the flats will do so because they will get passive income from it, and poor people who can't afford housing will be forced to rent at prices higher than otherwise.

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 14 points 3 months ago (3 children)

Let's translate yours: "I cannot conceive of a social housing system similar to that of social healthcare, in which people are guaranteed housing at affordable prices by law"

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 4 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (3 children)

Well, yes, I'm a communist, but seeing the housing in literally every western capitalist country suffering from the same issues, I have 0% of hope that the issue of housing will be solved within capitalism. Capitalists are in power and they're the ones owning the housing, so they simply will prevent legislation from passing unless forced by worker organizing.

I don't see why communism is equated with minimal houses though, housing size is more or less proportional to the wealth of the country and less so to ideological stuff. The USSR is famous for small socialist flats because most were built during industrialization in a post-war condition. East-Germany flats from the 1980s, for example, are much larger.

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 2 points 3 months ago

Then the government will need to purchase the houses / apartments from the current owners

Expropriation can be carried out without purchase, and it has been done in several countries to the great benefit of the workers. No need to pay for the housing of the landlords, we can just take it at gunpoint.

Then you’d still be paying rent, just to the government instead which will mostly go towards paying administrators that don’t care or do anything just like current landlords

Who says the housing has to be centrally administered? Housing could absolutely be organized by local collectives in charge of the maintenance of the buildings after its construction, likely in the form of democratically elected councils. As an example, most access to housing in the USSR was through the work's union, not through the central government.

Unless you mean all social government owned housing should be free

No, people should pay costs to maintain it. For example, rent in the USSR was about 3% of the monthly income. Seems much better than what I pay now!

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

See there’s an issue you want a one size fits all that’s never going to happen

It's happened historically in several countries, whereas georgism has happened in a total of 0.

Well through public ridicule or at gunpoint I’d imagine

Great. Now, who are the people organizing and agitating the workers to gather the numbers and strength to do this at gunpoint? Hint: again, not the Georgists

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 4 points 3 months ago (5 children)

you will barely find anyone outside your family willing to lend you a home

Yes, that's why housing ownership should primarily be socialized, and access to affordable rent should be a right guaranteed by the public administration as much as healthcare and education.

rent is close to or less than 4% of property value annually

That's still a worthless metric, though, rent should be proportional to construction costs + maintenance, not subjected to markets.

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 10 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Six paragraphs of you not understanding the issue: the problem is not the concept of renting a living space for a given time, the problem is private rent, i.e. rent for the landowner's profit.

Every single problem with current rent could be solved by socializing housing and making it available to rent at production+maintenance prices, and people could still move freely without being tied to a house in particular, without the risk of being evicted, would be able to paint the walls and have pets...

[–] Riverside@reddthat.com 3 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Nothing. Abolish all private rent and socialize it

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