this post was submitted on 13 May 2024
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Unpopular Opinion

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(Content warning, discussions of SA and misogyny, mods I might mention politics a bit but I hope this can be taken outside the context of politics and understood as a discussion of basic human decency)

We all know how awful Reddit was when a user mentioned their gender. Immediate harassment, DMs, etc. It's probably improved over the years? But still awful.

Until recently, Lemmy was the most progressive and supportive of basic human dignity of communities I had ever followed. I have always known this was a majority male platform, but I have been relatively pleased to see that positive expressions of masculinity have won out.

All of that changed with the recent "bear vs man" debacle. I saw women get shouted down just for expressing their stories of being sexually abused, repeatedly harassed, dogpiled, and brigaded with downvotes. Some of them held their ground, for which I am proud of them, but others I saw driven to delete their entire accounts, presumably not to return.

And I get it. The bear thing is controversial; we can all agree on this. But that should never have resulted in this level of toxicity!

I am hoping by making this post I can kind of bring awareness to this weakness, so that we can learn and grow as a community. We need to hold one another accountable for this, or the gender gap on this site is just going to get worse.

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[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (5 children)

I am a cis male mod of multiple communities here on Lemmy and all I can say is that I try to moderate as fairly and equitably as I can, but I also don't have time to read every single comment on every single post in the communities I moderate, so you have to flag posts you find violate community rules. Every community I moderate has a civility rule, and shouting down or harassing women who are telling personal stories would be against those rules.

But I may not know that it's happening unless it's getting flagged.

[–] whoreticulture@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 2 years ago (3 children)

🖕🏻🖕🏻🖕🏻🖕🏻 guess you can't handle a fucking emoji

https://theangryblackwoman.com/2008/02/12/the-privilege-of-politeness/

politeness is a social construct that disenfranchises the rightfully pissed. idk who is moderating here but they are clearly dumb as a box of brix if they think they're helping anything by blocking my comments that are clearly constructive as well as profane

[–] lemann@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

If you are not willing to follow the rules of this community clearly outlined in the sidebar, moderation action will be taken as necessary.

Your original comment, which was removed by another moderator, was a very clear attack towards the OC; Do note that attacks directed towards other users are not allowed in this community.

You are free to share your views in this community as long as they adhere to the community and this instance's rules. However, if your views on "civility/politeness" means you are complicit in attacking other users here, you are free to contribute elsewhere on the internet.

[–] whoreticulture@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

What did I say that was an attack? "fuck you"? is that an attack lmao ? these rules are arbitrarily enforced because I have seen people say that all the time, or say "fuck you" just in more words that they think are clever. the only reason I didn't put that in this post was I just forgot to lol

[–] JonsJava@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

We are volunteers, with full-time jobs. We don't watch all the comments in our communities. We tend to only act on reported infractions. For example, you are reported often for rule violations (rule 2, mostly).

[–] whoreticulture@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Okay, and can you see how this is messed up? People most often report "incivility" when someone is expressing a minority opinion. 🙄🙄

[–] JonsJava@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (2 children)

The point is that if you see things, report them. That's how we keep the community civil

[–] whoreticulture@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

My point is that civility rules are oppressive. Allow people to be justifiably upset. The civility rules will always favor majority held opinions. Read the article I linked, do some of your own research. You're upholding a dumbass rule that will inevitably, and has been, inconsistently used.

another source

https://youtu.be/ezQa9MzJiBg

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[–] supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz 0 points 2 years ago

That is how you keep a community peaceful, not civil.

In order to keep a community civil you have to understand when conflict is needed and also what types of people are usually silenced either by trolls or by selective enforcement of rules or community guidelines.

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (30 children)

Well excuse me for trying to be helpful.

Also, when did I say anything about politeness?

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[–] Rinna@lemm.ee 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (6 children)

People get really upset over a hypothetical. I don't like posts that put all men down, but this wasn't one of them.

Also bears generally mind their own business as long as you keep your distance, with statistically less than one person per year dying from a bear attack in America. The last time it happened in my state was several years ago and due to some dumbass intentionally getting close to it to take photos.

[–] whoreticulture@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Literally saw a bear this weekend and it just kinda minded it's own business and wandered away. Can't say the same about a lot of men.

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[–] TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

because hypotheticals are clean, not messy.

it's easy to be against incest hypothetically. it's a lot harder to be against it if your sister asks you to have sex with you.

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[–] LucidNightmare@lemm.ee 0 points 2 years ago (2 children)

You’re telling me that something that was intentionally supposed to induce division between normal ass people is inducing division between people?

Oh no!

Anyway, moral of the story, don’t get caught up in silly ass things like this. It was created to do exactly what it is doing.

[–] KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

pretty much exactly this. There is no way that statement wasn't designed intentionally this way.

I mean why else would it work so fucking aggressively?

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[–] pH3ra@lemmy.ml 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

The whole "bear vs. man" thing proved that there are still a lot of people out there totally unable to get over themselves. On one side you see people piling on women not knowing the everyday struggle the average woman goes through everyday, on the other side there are people that get mad at memes not accepting that the statement was meant to be over the top in the first place, so it's ok to find irony in it

[–] A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (5 children)

the response to the bear vs man thing is basically proof why most women chose bear.

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[–] Bonesince1997@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (3 children)

I've not even heard of this issue you are talking about. Maybe it's not representative of the Lemmy experience as a whole? Besides, most social media postings seem fake as hell. Why put any emphasis on what people have to say. I think walking away is probably the healthiest thing you can do. No one is going to fix this place or any place for that matter.

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