this post was submitted on 20 May 2025
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[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 57 points 1 day ago (4 children)

economics is not a science, it's not even a humanity; it's an inhumanity.

[–] spujb@lemmy.cafe 34 points 1 day ago (1 children)

i almost believe there has to be like a reckoning in economics, kind of like with psychology and the backlash against freud. far too many of the assumptions are taken for granted as fact despite haveing no data to back them (like the laffer curve, really?). they just get propogated because rich white men said stuff that benefits them.

like there is definitely some truth to glean in economics. but as it stands, it’s a disservice to call it a science.

[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 18 points 1 day ago (1 children)

like there is definitely some truth to glean in economics. but as it stands, it’s a disservice to call it a science.

absolutely, my statement was real edgelordy, but the idea behind economics, that is to say "resource management" is a valuable field of study, but as you say, it's all been manipulated shit to make the rich richer.

[–] spujb@lemmy.cafe 4 points 1 day ago

well expressed!

[–] Voroxpete@sh.itjust.works 17 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Economics is a science, at least in theory, but it's a science that's being practiced very badly.

The core issue is that pretty much the entire field has decided, collectively, that there is absolutely no requirement to test their assumptions against reality. Basically economists will build a model that reflects a vision of reality that seems to make sense to them, and then build a whole set of assertions supported by that model. I don't recall the origin of the quote, but it's been said that "Economists would study the price of milk by assuming an infinite number of frictionless spherical cows operating in an infinite vacuum."

When economists (most often ones who would describe themselves as progressive economists) actually do test the models against observable reality, most of them come crashing down. Good economic science instead says "What does reality tell us, and how can be we build models that explain it?", but right now good economic science is very much running against the mainstream.

There are good economists out there. The youtube channel Unlearning Economics is a fantastic starting point, as is this lecture series from McMaster University; https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLzLUWMt2NZLRmKY_kEiLc-hvOcyOlgE4N. I also suggest looking into David Graebar, Cristobal Young, and Mark Blyth. The Myth of Millionaire Tax Flight by Young and Austerity: The History of A Dangerous Idea by Blyth are both superbly informative and easy reads.

First “all models are flawed but that does not mean that they are worthless”

To be clear Graeber is an anthropologist and is not an economist. You might like what he says but his degree is in a different field

Cristobal Young is a sociologist again not an economist. You might like what they say that does not mean it has any merit economically speaking (I haven’t looked into any published work)

Blyth actually has a degree and background in political economics. Political economists are mixed bags as they tend to not be able to do the math to support their claims. As is the case with all social science the important part is to see if their claims were published in academic journals first. Blyth is ok not great IMO

[–] Rooskie91@discuss.online 19 points 1 day ago

It's a "science" manufactured to justify neoliberalism and a failing global capitalist system.

I'm a STEM person, so I thought I'd take an economics class in college and it's all basically voodoo. The textbook contradicted itself all the time and the reasoning was full of fallacies. Do not recommend.

[–] RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

What makes something scientific?

[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 1 points 23 hours ago (2 children)

that it's based on the scientific method, and there's repeatable experiments/steps to take with proven and proveable outcomes.

"Trickle down economics" is a fucking lie, yet we have zillions of (economic) liberals.

[–] lmmarsano@lemmynsfw.com 1 points 34 minutes ago

there’s repeatable experiments/steps to take with proven and proveable outcomes

Is astronomy a science?

Some sciences rely more on analysis & indirect observation. Direct experimentation can be intractable making testing of hypotheses & theories less straightforward.

Academic economics resources I've read (decades ago) are dismissive of trickle-down/supply-side economics.

[–] RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works 3 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

Ok so you might want to look that definition up because it’s not great.

No one who is educated in economics who is attempting to have an informed discussion of economics uses the term “trickle down economics”. Theproper term is supply side economics.

Trickle down is proposed by politicians not by economists because economists know it isn’t effective in most situations except things like housing eg (it’s easier to build more homes than convince people they don’t need one of their own)

[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world -2 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

great , now make it have an impact on people's lives that matters.

[–] RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works 2 points 20 hours ago

If you think economics has no impact on everyone you might want to check out this link:

https://ocw.mit.edu/courses/14-02-principles-of-macroeconomics-spring-2023/