this post was submitted on 18 May 2025
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MeanwhileOnGrad
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Thanks ;).
Okay I misspoke there. The wars that Israel periodically launches in Gaza are worse than anything that happens in the West Bank. Outside of those, however, the scale is pretty comparable; you have airstrikes and the blockade on one hand and pogroms and arrests (glorified kidnappings) on the other.
Yasser Arafat's PLO and Mahmoud Abbas's PLO are completely different entities and should be viewed as such. Yasser Arafat certainly wasn't organizing crackdowns against Palestinian resistance organizations to appease Israel; he came from the era when the PLO conducted and organized resistance.
Any time before 1987, and the period between 1993 and the Second Intifada. Also the gaps between uprisings, wars and the like post-2007, so for example 2017.
Again, whether the West was interested doesn't matter; the problem is whether they cared. How much grassroots action was there in Western countries to stop Israel from ethnically cleansing Palestinians before 2007?
Uh... Yes? BDS's size and reach is a good shorthand for how much Western sympathy that matters is with Palestine, and, well, you can see for yourself. I mean seriously there's a reason Zionists hate these guys so much and it's not because they were irrelevant until a year and a half ago.
What? Absolutely not. If it's gonna lead to action their opinion regarding Hamas doesn't matter. I mean I definitely want Hamas gone and replaced with a less tyrannical government.
They pretty much are. I mean they only really represent Gaza, but since the West Bank hasn't really been doing much since the Second Intifada, the Palestinian struggle is only really happening in Gaza with a few flare ups in the West Bank every now and then, no thanks to the PA.
As opposed to... doing nothing? Because again that's what Fatah has been doing since 2006—nothing. They've cracked down on Palestinian opposition to Israel more than they've done to oppose Israel.
Huh? I was referring to the Israeli right, which should've been obvious from context.
The period between 1993 and 2000? You mean when it was one of the core foreign policy issues in US politics!?
2017? The first year of the fucking Trump administration, when the issue of Israel was front and center?
This is deeply unserious.
Palestinian activism was one of the issues of Western left-leaning parties outside the US in the 90s and 2000s, and of the left wing of the Dems in the US.
BDS is overwhelmingly the result of a change in tactics, notably pre-dating Hamas's ascendency, and popular support in the US for Palestine was largely static until Oct 7th.
Oh, cool, so how's the struggle in Gaza going?
Oh, they're about to have the entire strip ethnically cleansed?
Good thing that Hamas was the one which managed to get international recognition towards a Palestinian state, it would have been really awful if those do-nothings in the PLO were the ones busy recieving international support while Hamas did Mossad's bidding. I mean, wouldn't it be horrific if it turned out that Hamas's only achievements were helping Israel murder Palestinians, and people were defending them for it?
Not that I think Fatah's current route is productive, but yes, doing nothing is, by definition, better than doing something counterproductive. That's literally what counterproductive means.
Then I misread it. Apologies. That leaves the comment it was originally responding to uncontested, though, as Fatah being 'deeply compromised' while Hamas is lionized is absurd considering Hamas has been explicitly supported by Israel as their ideal partner in Palestinian genocide.