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Jill Stein on America's democracy crisis, movement building and ending Israel's war on Palestinians
(www.middleeasteye.net)
this post was submitted on 18 Aug 2024
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politics
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I'm not asking you to vote for the Dems as much as I would like you to, but don't pretend the greens are a real party with a shot at anything more than a joke or spoiler effect when they can't even get one national office or even have the infrastructure available to do more than pretend.
If you want people to think your party isn't a joke spoiler party, you should be able to tell people why they aren't. Your responses amount to nothing more than "stop making fun of their problems" without explaining why, and I'm not going to do so without actual arguments.
I'd love to see more than just the Democrats and Republicans available as options (and I put my money where my mouth is locally). I just don't see many 3rd parties do more than a token effort every few years to be part of the national conversation. And any party that sits on its ass for 3.5 years and can't even get a single national office shouldn't be under consideration for the highest national office.
Lol, even with Biden's shitty odds, there is no comparison to the green party. The Democrats statistically COULD WIN even with all the issues Biden has. Hell, even Johnson and the libertarians have a better shot than the greens, and they're a joke with no chance too.
The greens objectively, have 0 chances due to not having a real base, 0 infrastructure, and 0 national offices to show that they have the knowledge to even be under consideration as anything more than a laugh or protest vote. This is why the green party is a joke, and will be until they do more than pop up on the national radar every 4 years.
They show up every year in local elections.
Yeah, and have elected <250 people nationally and only on local offices, so you're not helping your argument.
I'm not arguing anything. I am giving facts. Do think I don't know how many people the Green Party has voted to office? Public knowledge. No one is trying to hide that from you. lol
This is what you were responding to, and was the point of my response.
They don't do anything more than show up to the presidential election on a national scale, so you're only adding to my point about them not being a national party.
Then you have nothing to worry about, right?
You haven't changed my mind at all. :)
Dismissing the Green Party as a "joke" or "spoiler" ignores the historical importance of third parties in American politics.
Many of the progressive policies we take for granted today—like the abolition of slavery, women's suffrage, and labor rights—were championed by third parties long before they were adopted by the major parties.
The Green Party, despite its challenges, offers a platform that aligns with values many Americans hold, including environmental sustainability, social justice, and peace.
While it's true that the Greens haven't secured a national office, it's also important to recognize the structural barriers that third parties face in our political system. These barriers include ballot access laws, exclusion from debates, and the massive financial advantage that the two major parties hold. These challenges make it difficult for any third party to break through, but that doesn’t mean their efforts are worthless or that their ideas aren’t valuable. In fact, their presence can influence the national conversation and push the major parties to address issues they might otherwise ignore.
You mention that the Democrats statistically could win, but that’s precisely the problem. We’re stuck in a cycle where voting is more about choosing the lesser of two evils rather than voting for policies and candidates that truly represent our values. The fact that the Green Party and other third parties have an uphill battle doesn’t make them a "joke"; it makes them the underdogs in a deeply flawed system. By supporting them, I’m voting for what I believe in, rather than settling for a party that continually fails to represent my interests.
So while I understand your point, I see the value in supporting third parties, even if they face significant obstacles. It's about building a movement and showing that there is a demand for alternatives to the two-party system. The only way to give them a shot is for more people to support them, and that starts with voters like me choosing to vote for what we believe in, rather than what the system tells us is the only viable option.
Plus, I’m now leaning towards the Socialist Workers Party as well, because I believe in the need for a broader political discourse that goes beyond the status quo. The Socialist Workers Party, like the Greens, challenges the dominance of corporate interests in our politics and advocates for the working class—something neither of the major parties genuinely prioritize.
So joke to you or not, I'm not voting democrat. Accept it.
What part of my last post made you think I'm upset about you not voting Democrat? I could give a shit if you vote for them, as much as I would like it, I care about people pretending that the green party is more than just a spoiler party when they don't put forth the effort required to do what other third parties do.
This isn't "the system vs the greens" this is the greens being too lazy to perform basic party actions and blaming the systems for failures other parties don't have.
The greens are my problem here, not third parties. But you don't want to hear that part, so I'm done arguing with you about it.
Awesome! I support you voting for whoever you want. As I am going to vote for who I want to. As is my right.
Yep, you have a right to waste your vote on a joke spoiler party. No one has said otherwise at any point in this conversation.
That I don't think is a joke spoiler party. No one has said otherwise at any point in this conversation.
And you have every right to ignore reality as well. We even have a major party that does so as well.
No, you've stated your opinion multiple times, and I've explained why your opinion doesn't match reality.
In YOUR opinion. You realize that I'm not the only one voting green right? There are lots of other people doing it to. But let me gues, they are ALL crazy too, right?
Also, almost half of the country isn't voting for your candidate. Welcome to democracy.
I support you voting for whoever you want. And I am voting for whoever I want to.
My opinion, the objective reality where Stein has not done anything more than lose presidential election after election and never gaining a single national seat.
Poh-tay-toh
Puh-tah-toe
And you're totally welcome to that opinion. As I am welcome to mine. And I'm still not voting for Harris. See how that works?
I didn't realize that provable facts are opinions now, but I guess greens see the world differently.
You can keep your alternative facts to yourself.
And again, I give two shits you're not voting for harris, you're not going to upset me because you don't like my parties candidate nearly as much as you're getting upset about me not liking your party's candidate.
And no matter how upset you get, the green party is still a joke party that can't win a single national seat. See how that works?
I'm not upset at all. You are entitled to your opinion. As am I.
I'm not upset. I'm also not voting for your candidate. See how that works?
[X] Doubt
Yes, I saw how that worked the first time, which is why I doubt you're not upset. But I'll save us both some time and block you so you don't get your blood pressure too high.
Feel free to have the last word, I know you need it.
Block away. Thank you!