this post was submitted on 08 Feb 2025
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We live in ~~a society~~ an ecosphere.
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No system but the ecosystem
What does that even mean?
Here's an aspect: https://www.radicalphilosophy.com/article/nature-in-the-limits-to-capital-and-vice-versa
Top fig. from https://www.degrowthinstitute.org/challenge-growth01
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I didn't say it was impossible, just that it makes more sense as orbiting plates (and that was Dyson's original proposal).
I was going to try to figure out what material you'd have to even build it out of, to prove you wrong that it actually would be impossible, but it turns out building a solid shell actually isn't completely nutty from a pure structural perspective.
If we have:
Then the compressive stress (σ) the material needs to withstand would be:
σ = (GMρt)/(r²)
Because:
So long story short, you could build it out of plain structural steel (compressive yield strength around 250-500 megapascals) with a safety factor of 5, and you'd have:
Means:
So you could put it at 36.6 million km from the sun, about halfway to Mercury's orbit, or closer if you used a stronger material, or any further distance away if for some reason you wanted to (maybe to increase your margin for error in dealing with overheating issues). However... at that distance, you would need 8.4e25 kg of iron, or 14 Earth masses. If you tried to get closer to the sun to minimize your materials cost, then you'd quickly run into increasing structural strength needed. The pure size is really going to limit what elements you're going to be able to make it out of. I guess you could say that we're doing it out of some carbon nanostructure material or something that doesn't exist yet, or transmuting elements to build it, in which case there's no point in doing the math because we can't say anything about how strong or heavy it might be... if you tried to guess based on current carbon nanotubes, you could say the compressive strength is around 100-150 GPa, so you can put it 10 million km from the sun, and you need one-third of an Earth's mass worth of carbon, which I guess is doable if we're assuming the technology and resource extraction has reached that point.
Or, you could just do big orbiting plates with present-day technology, and make them as thin as you want, and not have to do it as a single massive project, and be able to correct their orbits individually instead of having a single leviathan that will cause a planet-scale catastrophe if it ever falls off its balanced position, and probably some other advantages I haven't thought of.
TL;DR Use plates.
I'm super impressed with your effort on this. I actually learned quite a bit. I totally agree that a Dyson swarm would be better
Never underestimate the motivating factor of wanting to prove someone wrong on the internet. 😃