this post was submitted on 29 Jul 2026
87 points (96.8% liked)

Atheism

6294 readers
60 users here now

Community Guide


Archive Today will help you look at paywalled content the way search engines see it.


Statement of Purpose

Acceptable

Unacceptable

Depending on severity, you might be warned before adverse action is taken.

Inadvisable


Application of warnings or bans will be subject to moderator discretion. Feel free to appeal. If changes to the guidelines are necessary, they will be adjusted.


If you vocally harass or discriminate against any individual member, you will be removed.

Likewise, if you are a member, sympathizer or a resemblant of a group that is known to largely hate, mock, discriminate against, and/or want to take lives of any other group of people, and you were provably vocal about your hate, then you you will be banned on sight.

Provable means able to provide proof to the moderation, and, if necessary, to the community.

 ~ /c/nostupidquestions

If you want your space listed in this sidebar and it is especially relevant to the atheist or skeptic communities, PM DancingPickle and we'll have a look!


Connect with Atheists

Help and Support Links

Streaming Media

This is mostly YouTube at the moment. Podcasts and similar media - especially on federated platforms - may also feature here.

Orgs, Blogs, Zines

Mainstream

Bibliography

Start here...

...proceed here.

Proselytize Religion

From Reddit

As a community with an interest in providing the best resources to its members, the following wiki links are provided as historical reference until we can establish our own.

founded 3 years ago
MODERATORS
 

cross-posted from: https://lemmy.zip/post/68752761 which was cross-posted from: https://sh.itjust.works/post/64103917

I thought about saying "you know it's a grift when they collect personal information and leak it." According to their Bible, you don't need an app to pray. They say church (or a covenant, I forget, it's been 30+ years since I read the KJV) is when any two people come together to talk about Jesus (sorry!). So, where does an app fit in? And why does that app need your personally identifiable information (referred to as PII in industry). Wouldn't an all-knowing God already have it?

But you don't have to know it's a grift... I feel like this is proof the Vatican (or whoever made this app on their behalf, and thus speak on their behalf... and the Pope allegedly speaks on God's behalf) themselves know it's a grift. Because why would they need your PII?

I know, fools and their money are soon parted... just saw this on /all and figured the Fediverse's top Atheism comm should have it.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] IAMgROOT@lemmy.wtf -1 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

When cases of sexual abuse within the Catholic Church became known, the German Bishops’ Conference (Deutsche Bischofskonferenz, DBK) commissioned a study by an interdisciplinary consortium to determine the frequency of sexual abuse by Catholic clergy in Germany (the MHG study).

1670 persons belonging to the Catholic clergy who were accused of sexual abuse of minors were identified from their personnel files, corresponding to 4.4% of the clergy overall.

The DBK requested this study in the first place, and 4.4% of all clergy since the 1910s in Germany

Also, there have been many scientifically proven miracles.

[–] SnoopSqueak@lemmy.today 1 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

They protect pedophiles until they cannot, if the evidence is overwhelming. How many are they still protecting today? How many were simply sent to other churches to harm more victims?

Still happening this year, actively covering up abuse: https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2026/01/27/catholic-abuse-powerful-utah/

Also, there have been many scientifically proven miracles.

Define "miracle". Name one that has been scientifically proven.

[–] IAMgROOT@lemmy.wtf -1 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

an otherwise impossible act done by God

The Eucharistic Miracle of Buenos Aires

[–] SnoopSqueak@lemmy.today 2 points 7 hours ago (2 children)

But you never proved or defined "god".

Anyway, even catholic scientists admit your example is not a miracle: https://drjulesgomes.substack.com/p/catholic-scientists-debunk-assertions

Catholic scientists are now urging the faithful to be cautious about claims that eucharistic miracles have been scientifically proven, as unconsecrated hosts tested under similar conditions have also shown similar “bleeding” appearances.

Peer-reviewed studies published by Catholic scientists who believe in Christ’s real presence in the Eucharist have also dismissed assertions that the miracles were validated by research carried out by the World Health Organization (WHO) and the United Nations (UN).

Would you like to try another? Spoiler: they're all bullshit, magic isn't real. Please use your brain.

[–] IAMgROOT@lemmy.wtf 1 points 7 hours ago

they APPEAR to be bleeding due to serratia marascens, a red pigmented bacterium.

But multiple tests for serratia are done in the case of eucharistic miracles

[–] IAMgROOT@lemmy.wtf -1 points 7 hours ago (2 children)
[–] SnoopSqueak@lemmy.today 2 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

Interesting, I'd love to see the report. Ah, it's linked at the bottom of the article. Hmm, the link is unsafe, certificate expired two years ago. I proceeded with caution and saw... a 404 error.

There is no evidence of this supposed miracle.

[–] IAMgROOT@lemmy.wtf 0 points 6 hours ago (2 children)
[–] SnoopSqueak@lemmy.today 2 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

That is a letter, not a report.

I have not been able to find the report myself, but other scientists have commented on it, including catholic "scientists":

DR. KELLY KEARSE, A CHEMIST SPECIALIZING IN BLOOD RESEARCH AND IMMUNOLOGY AND A TEACHER AT KNOXVILLE CATHOLIC HIGH SCHOOL, IS CALLING FOR THE USE OF MORE ACCURATE RESEARCH METHODS IN INVESTIGATING THE SHROUD OF TURIN AND OTHER RELIGIOUS PHENOMENA THOUGHT TO BE DIVINE.

Dr. Kearse points out important natural explanations that were never addressed. Until those are ruled out as causes, it is premature to claim a miracle.

It seems remarkable that all five test for the same, rare blood type. But there is a problem: the A and B antigens are not unique to humans. Since the 1960s, biologists have known that bacteria cells also have A and B antigens on their surfaces. Hence, if a sample is contaminated with bacteria, even if it contains no blood at all, it could still show a type AB blood result in this test.

A “very low concentration of human DNA” is indicative of handling contamination. In forensic DNA tests, trace amounts of DNA from humans who touch a sample can be unintentionally amplified, and reports say the hosts were touched by several people.

https://etcatholic.org/2025/01/exaggerations-and-eucharistic-miracles/

[–] IAMgROOT@lemmy.wtf -1 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

"It seems remarkable that all five test for the same, rare blood type. But there is a problem: the A and B antigens are not unique to humans. Since the 1960s, biologists have known that bacteria cells also have A and B antigens on their surfaces. Hence, if a sample is contaminated with bacteria, even if it contains no blood at all, it could still show a type AB blood result in this test.

Yet, without anyone ever checking for bacteria as the explanation, the claim about the blood type is often repeated as miraculous."

They do check for Serratia, thats literally the FIRST thing they do

Dr. Kearse devised, for the first time ever, a set of control experiments. He obtained unconsecrated Communion wafers and processed them according to the same conditions described above. He left them in a dusty, dark corner for several days and then stored them in water at ambient temperature and humidity for seven to 10 days. Approximately 15 percent of the control wafers formed a gelatinous red substance on the surface, like the photos from the eucharistic miracle reports.

Microscopy, fluorescence, and molecular biology techniques showed the reddish substance to be fungus and bacteria. Again, this is a natural explanation that was not checked but easily could be. Dr. Kearse presents a variety of tests showing that blood can easily be distinguished from microorganisms. As before, genetic testing would ultimately confirm what the red substances are and whether they have a single origin.

They test for serratia

The other AB results are from cloths believed to have touched Jesus at the crucifixion (the relics): the Shroud of Turin (a burial garment), the Tunic of Argenteuil (a seamless robe), and the Sudarium of Oviedo (a face cloth).

Also, Sokolka went through electron microscopy, and serratia tests.

" Two independent university professors. Professor Maria Elżbieta Sobaniec-Łotowska and Professor Stanisław Sulkowski, both of the Department of Pathomorphology at the Medical University of Białystok, conducted independent analyses and reached the same conclusion — without consulting each other.

  • The tissue is cardiac muscle. Both professors identified the substance as human cardiac muscle tissue (myocardium) based on multiple diagnostic features: segmentation and fragmentation of muscle fibers, communicating junctions characteristic of heart muscle, centrally positioned cellular nuclei, and contraction nodes.
  • Electron microscopy confirmation. Electron microscope imaging revealed intact myofibril filaments and junction outlines — structures visible only at extreme magnification that are uniquely characteristic of cardiac muscle. This level of structural preservation in unpreserved tissue exposed to water is, by established science, impossible.
  • No decomposition. The tissue showed no signs of autolysis (cellular self-destruction) — a process that begins within hours of tissue death and is accelerated by water exposure. The professors explicitly noted that a bacterial culture would deteriorate within a week under similar conditions, yet this tissue remained intact for months.
  • Tissue fused with bread at fiber level. Microscopic examination showed that the cardiac tissue was intertwined with the bread fibers of the Host at a structural level — not sitting on the surface, but integrated into the substrate. The scientists stated this phenomenon could not be replicated or explained by any known natural process.
  • Official Church confirmation. On October 14, 2009, the Metropolitan Curia of Białystok issued an official statement confirming the scientific findings and declaring that the event "does not contradict the faith of the Church, but rather confirms it."
  • Consistent with the global pattern. The identification of cardiac muscle tissue places Sokółka in a direct line with Lanciano (1970 analysis), Buenos Aires (2004 analysis), and Tixtla (2009–2012 analysis) — four independent scientific investigations across three centuries of miracles, all finding the same tissue type."
[–] SnoopSqueak@lemmy.today 1 points 5 hours ago

Sokolka went through electron microscopy, and serratia tests.

How do we know that?

I found a Polish newspaper article suggesting the research was amateurishly performed and should have been more extensive. I used the auto-translate feature that my browser has, I can't guarantee accuracy.

https://www.rp.pl/kosciol/art7471901-co-sie-naprawde-stalo-w-sokolce

What kind of research did Professor Sulkowski perform? It's unclear exactly. He enigmatically replies that it fell within the scope of his specialty.

However, he refuses to say how the nuclei were arranged in the fiber of the tissue he examined. "Such questions fall within the purview of the appropriate commission investigating the miracle," he says, cutting the conversation short.

DNA testing would precisely indicate whether the tissue being examined is human or animal, and whether it's male or female. "We would determine with a high degree of probability what region of the world it comes from. We would dispel any doubts," assures Professor Śliwka.

Prof. Chyczewski: – The Archbishop was not interested in conducting such research. I was told that since the material was believed to be of miraculous origin, there was no need to bother with it any further.

Did he even publish his results? There should be images, evidence. So far we still just have claims.

[–] IAMgROOT@lemmy.wtf 0 points 6 hours ago

this is the buenos aires one