this post was submitted on 22 Nov 2023
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Why is Lemmygrad hated in the wider space of Lemmy? (lemm.ee)
submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
21 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

I've been trying to find a good Marxist instance, but Lemmygrad and Hexbear are widely hated. Why is that? Are there any good leftist instances?

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Lemmygrad isn't "hated" by most of the wider lemmyverse. There's just a loud and obnoxious minority of people that will rail and rant about lemmygrad. They loudly rant about lemmygrad because they aren't used to seeing their worldview get challenged and by its very nature as a radical leftist community, lemmygrad is a challenge to the typical background liberal perspective.

It's no surprise we all end up seeing a lot of threads about "those mean tankies at lemmygrad" (and hexbear too) made by people who can't take their worldview getting questioned, or even shown to be flawed, or just not standing up to their own scrutiny, and who get mad when that happens. There are also of course people with ideological reasons to demonize leftwing politics and will spread shit for that reason alone. But overall, I don't think most people care enough except to think "oh yeah that's that instance with those radical lefties, they're weird but they do make some great memes sometimes."

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

There are people who called the main lemmy.ml instance a community of tankies, so I'd take a lot of these claims with a grain of salt.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I'm pretty left/lean socialist. The tankies that annoy me from those instances are pro authoritarian communists who say shit like "Stalin did nothing wrong" with no irony whatsoever. It's not really about bickering over ideological purity past a certain point, some of that shit makes a good case for the horseshoe theory

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

What's a leftist stance you take?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

"I'm as left as they come but I'm still going to throat the entire State Department patent leather shoe talm bout 'authoritarians' like that's anything more than another white-folk-slur for brown leaders who deny them" you are a fucking joke

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Lemmygrad and Hexbear aren’t “leftist” in the confused sense that Americans usually mean “leftist.” They’re actually leftist in the original sense, meaning that they want to abolish private ownership of the means of production. To the extent they’re “widely hated,” it’s largely because the Anglosphere has been indoctrinated against real, actual socialism their entire lives.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

That's not the part people have an issue with, the part where their users deny genocides, call everyone that has a less extreme left opinion of politics Nazis, end up being so "anti-racism" that they're racists themselves and take all critics as personal attacks, that's what people have an issue with.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The “Uyghur genocide” is bullshit Atlanticist propaganda, and English-language Wikipedia is basically NATOpedia in its slant on the topic, so yes we will deny it. It’s a product of the new Cold War propaganda campaign against China.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

end up being so “anti-racism” that they’re racists themselves

anyone complaining about "reverse racism" or "anti white racism" is a complete joke. like boo fucking hoo, someone called you a cracker on the internet, get over it.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Racism has a definition that's fairly easy to understand and yes people of all colors can be victims and even people of the same skin colour can be racists against one another because racism isn't necessarily about the color of your skin, it can be about your ethnicity.

Racism:

prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership in a particular racial or ethnic group, typically one that is a minority or marginalized.

Ethnicity:

the quality or fact of belonging to a population group or subgroup made up of people who share a common cultural background or descent.

If you had taken a crowd of anonymous Germans all dressed the same in 1935, how would you have told who was a Jew and who wasn't? You wouldn't have been able to because they were all just white people.

What do you call it when 100 years ago in a first world white country the population that speaks one official language has an infant mortality rate comparable to that of colonial Africa while the population that speaks the other official language and lives in the same cities has an infant mortality rate comparable to any other first world nation?

Was the Rwanda genocide not racism because it was two groups with the same skin colour? What about what happened in Yugoslavia?

My white friend who went to China to study had to sit through multiple explanations by many Chinese student of the levels of intelligence being affected by skin colour and ethnicity and guess what, whites weren't at the top! "All white people are dumber than Indians who are dumber than Koreans who are dumber than Chinese." Are you telling me that isn't racism against white people (and anyone that isn't Chinese)? Because I sure would hope someone would call me a racist if I was saying the same thing about people of another skin colour or ethnicity!

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Holy shit you got them to brigade your comment. They might as well be bots, I think Chat GPT's "intelligence" outpaces them.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago

As is tradition! What's funny is that they're supposed to be defederated from my instance so I don't know why they even see my comments... Their admin even called my instance "sh.itsfullof.nazis" in their defederation message because they were angry that they were confronted to people who disagreed with them when they brigaded our administration communities...

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Any politically focused space on the Internet, left or right, is a cesspool of toxic lies and hatred of anyone outside their sphere

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

British. Immediately discarded.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

That's what we call racism

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago

im british and i give them the g-word pass (gammon) to refer to british people in a derogatory way

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I can't speak about lemmygrad since the instances I'm on all defederate from it, but Hexbear users have a reputation for being generally aggressive, grating, and immature. It's like that kid in class who keeps interrupting the teacher because they think they're funny and clever. e.g., some were screaming at me that I can't be an anarchist and I know nothing about anarchism since I'm married, replying with third-grade tier memes for some confusing reason

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Thought I should add it was them informing me that certain countries banning same-sex marriage while endorsing heterosexual marriage is just fine, actually. They espoused an objectively homophobic belief, and when I referenced my own marriage, they switched to calling me ignorant about anarchism. There are anarchist texts exploring the issue and some of the potential problems with traditions like marriage, but it's not dogma. Nor do I view my own relationship as hierarchical.

TL;DR They were being objectively homophobic.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

This has the energy of a white gay man in a marriage pointing at a trans polycule and calling them homophobic because they said he had a bad take about how bourgeois privileges are more important than positive rights for queer homeless people.

White gay men wielding their gayness as a cudgel against people who are queerer and more marginalized then them sure is a gross thing to see.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Your comment is a perfect example of the pants-shittingly off-topic LGBTphobic nonsense I was receiving in the other thread, so thanks for proving my point.

You ... you do realize that trans people and other "queerer" people than me engage in same-sex marriage too, right? And that it's objectively homophobic for a policy to exist forbidding same-sex marriage while permitting heterosexual marriage? And that not all trans people are poly? I know people that fit all of the above, and every one of them deserves validation, and it would be unfathomably LGBTphobic for me to arbitrarily determine which ones are "queer enough" to be part of the community. You don't see the problem with this line of thinking, with your entire statement? Of course you do, you're just being deliberately cruel for your own amusement.

There it is, folks. Exhibit A

Edit: That user is a moderator on [email protected]

I'm unsubscribing immediately! And I blocked and reported that user, too.

My love is for all the LGBT+ community, and for the straight cis community as well. I just want equity. For anyone who had to read that homophobic comment above, just know that I do care, and I'm here for you.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

And that it’s objectively homophobic for a policy to exist forbidding same-sex marriage while permitting heterosexual marriage?

Yes!

Do you acknowledge that some countries like the US which allow gay marriage materially harm lgbt people more than some countries that have banned gay marriage? Or is it only homophobic when it impacts your middle class ass?

Do you acknowledge that many socialist countries are progressive and moving toward more rights, and just starting from a worse starting point because of violently enforced colonial attitudes from countries that now claim to be progressive?

Do you acknowledge that Cuba, a socialist nation that you'd accuse of being tankie, is the place where lgbt people have the most material rights?

Do you acknowledge that communists have led every single queer liberation movement that has forced concessions from ruling governments? Or do you want to whitewash the communists out of stonewall?

You … you do realize that trans people and other “queerer” people than me engage in same-sex marriage too, right?

Yes, I'm one of them. And I'd happily give up my right to be married if it would erase queer homelessness, and erase conversion therapy camps, and erase the continual murder of black and indigenous trans women in our society.