this post was submitted on 13 May 2024
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Unpopular Opinion

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(Content warning, discussions of SA and misogyny, mods I might mention politics a bit but I hope this can be taken outside the context of politics and understood as a discussion of basic human decency)

We all know how awful Reddit was when a user mentioned their gender. Immediate harassment, DMs, etc. It's probably improved over the years? But still awful.

Until recently, Lemmy was the most progressive and supportive of basic human dignity of communities I had ever followed. I have always known this was a majority male platform, but I have been relatively pleased to see that positive expressions of masculinity have won out.

All of that changed with the recent "bear vs man" debacle. I saw women get shouted down just for expressing their stories of being sexually abused, repeatedly harassed, dogpiled, and brigaded with downvotes. Some of them held their ground, for which I am proud of them, but others I saw driven to delete their entire accounts, presumably not to return.

And I get it. The bear thing is controversial; we can all agree on this. But that should never have resulted in this level of toxicity!

I am hoping by making this post I can kind of bring awareness to this weakness, so that we can learn and grow as a community. We need to hold one another accountable for this, or the gender gap on this site is just going to get worse.

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[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (19 children)

I commented about it and some guy replaced every instance of the word “men” in my post with “Jews” to prove to me that I am a bigot. His comment was removed by mods, but later un-removed because we’re big fans of bad faith arguments and invalid comparisons on this platform.

e: argue this point with women in person and see how well it goes.

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[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

Same goes for harassing those men who rejected the notion of the meme with civility.

Plenty of simple trolls trying to insert the word "incel" wherever they can, and plenty of people trying to invalidate everything men have to say.

Lemmy is becoming more known, and with that comes the point at which bots and trolls emerge. We have to respond accordingly - and remember to be united and civil, even in disagreements.

And yes, ragebait content should be banned. The bear hypothetical is one of those, since it does imply anti-male sentiment, but does it in a way that can be minimized to "women just complaining". It is a very malicious attempt at generating a lot of hostility, to the point where it's hard even to give benefit of the doubt.

As per "how we attract women" in particular, I think the most important part is to make Lemmy less about tech and politics and more about all sorts of hobbies, occupations, and a fun time. While women are very welcome in the tech and politics spaces, those spaces are historically dominated by men, and for as long as those are the pillars of the Lemmy conversations, we'll see this gap over and over.

We can't take bias in support of women just to attract more of them on the platform, this won't end well. We need to protect everyone from the harassment and trolling, regardless of gender.

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[–] [email protected] 2 points 4 months ago

You're right. It's also hostile to enbies.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago

Source for the hostile comments? I know that these types of people make up the minority of users, but I would still like a source for these hateful comments.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (9 children)

Regarding Man v Bear I think the topic is rather silly. Most bears aren't looking to have a meet and greet if you do come across a bear one of three things are true. It's here to eat you, it didn't leave because its a she-bear and it has cubs its protecting, or you just startled it. If any of the above is true you are at best in serious danger. If it is actually trying to prey upon you then you are probably fucked. Whereas 100% of the bears you surprise in the woods are extremely dangerous 99.99% of people you meet man or woman are just people like yourself not looking for trouble.

It's not shocking that the 99.9% of men who aren't predators waiting in the bush feel justified in feeling unfairly vilified.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago (10 children)

My proverbial beef isn't the pointing out of how manny men are predators and that the risksfor women are non-zero; my problem more specifically is that the meme stacks handily on top of the already vexing racial profiling I deal with as a black man who's had false allegations leveled in the past and lost jobs because of the weaponization of this fear. I have already spent damn near a half century being presumed some kind of feral Mandingo rape beast purely for existing while black. The presumption of interest in all of these women like a scene out of Kentucky Fried Movie gets really old and they get super vindictive when rejected.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago

I feel for you, the casual racism and sexism against black men is pretty crazy. Used to work with a guy that wore a suit every day in a very casual office, because women wouldn't get on the elevator with him otherwise.

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago

The introverted tech nerds have always had a problem with dismissing anything they don't immediately understand

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I literally have no clue what man vs bear is and honestly sounds like it should stay that way1

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (7 children)

It's a thought experiment. Women are asked if they'd rather stumble upon a bear or a man in the woods. Most women choose bear. Some boys got really offended at the women's choice.

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago

i'm just a little disappointed woman seem to consistently be a minority here

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Can anyone share the bear thing? I've no idea what you're talking about.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

~~ur the one reading a post from half a year ago hehe~~ edit i totally misread like 4 of your words, my fault! here ya go https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/news/2024/04/30/man-bear-tiktok-debate-explainer/73519921007/

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