PhilipTheBucket

Sinclair also calls upon Mr. Kimmel to issue a direct apology to the Kirk family. Furthermore, we ask Mr. Kimmel to make a meaningful personal donation to the Kirk Family and Turning Point USA.

Man go fuck yourself

Here's the broadcast, if anyone wants to put these "inappropriate and deeply insensitive" remarks in the context of what he actually said: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-j3YdxNSzTk

Yeah, the post itself kinda rang some bullshit-alarms to me for reasons I can't completely articulate. That's partly why I decided to do a spot check of what it was saying. And yeah, regardless of what was there, we learned that goat is shifty in some way with his mod actions and behaviors, and also sort of at least pro-Israel-adjacent it looks like, and also apparently has some kind of beef with /0 now I guess. I still don't completely know what is going on with them but it seems like nothing good.

I've said before, I think that there are people deliberately trying to stir up inter-instance drama from time to time, spinning up genuine but pretty minor issues into reasons to create rifts between the "pro-AI" and "anti-AI" camps for example, or between the vegans and everyone else, or now (apparently it might seem) between the anti-tankies generally speaking and the dbzer0 people. That's one explanation for why this is happening that makes somewhat more sense to me than anything else I can guess as to why goat might have started to do this. I see a whole bunch of anti-dbzer0 posts in the recent past on MOG as well. That whole "It's all dbzer0's fault that davel has done this" line of argument sort of reads textbook similar to ways in the past that I've observed people trying to get two third parties to conflict with one another.

That's all just random guessing, I have no idea, just throwing out one theory for why goat might be being weird in this one particular way (especially if they have history of doing other odd things.)

@eugenevdebs@lemmy.dbzer0.com poking me claiming I'd been "caught lying" about something else needled me to actually look up what I was looking at back when this happened. Here's this post:

• https://quokk.au/post/144284
  • Source breakdown
    • 0.0% upvotes are from lemmy.dbzer0.com
    • 29.4% downvotes are from lemmy.dbzer0.com
  • Time breakdown
    • 0-15m: +3 up, -7 down
    • 15-30m: +1 up, -2 down
    • 30-45m: +2 up
    • 45-60m: +2 up, -3 down
    • 75-90m: -3 down
    • 90-105m: +1 up
    • 105-120m: -2 down

So what you're looking at there is what percent of the total votes (up and down) came from a lemmy.dbzer0.com account, and then a breakdown of what came in during any given 15-minute window during the two hours immediately following the post.

Having 30% of the votes come in from a single instance when the post was posted to a busy lemmy.world community is hugely sus, since the percent of Lemmy users who are even on dbzer0.com is so small compared with other instances. And then, that pattern of a huge influx of votes in one direction right after the thing is posted, with a ratio of up to downvotes (and a much higher volume in one direction only) that doesn't match the ratio you see for most of the lifetime, is often an indication of voter fraud or coordinated voting. It's actually even more tightly clustered than it looks like on there, those 7 downvotes all came in during one single 5-minute window of rapid fire downvoting, way more active than any time before or after that 5-minute window. It shows on the lemvotes page which is what the script that made that draws from. A lot of Reddit voter fraud was based on sort of "painting the tape" right when something was posted -- people tend to upvote what's already upvoted and downvote likewise, and it'll have a corresponding impact on putting it in front of people or hiding it from them respectively.

For reference if you want to see, here are examples of what a more normal layout of voting would look like:

• https://lemmy.world/post/33473245
  • Source breakdown
    • 1.3% upvotes are from lemmy.dbzer0.com
    • 0.0% downvotes are from lemmy.dbzer0.com
  • Time breakdown
    • 0-15m: +3 up
    • 15-30m: +3 up
    • 30-45m: +12 up
    • 45-60m: +10 up, -1 down
    • 60-75m: +16 up
    • 75-90m: +9 up
    • 90-105m: +12 up
    • 105-120m: +12 up, -1 down
• https://lemmy.world/post/33466438
  • Source breakdown
    • 10.0% upvotes are from lemmy.dbzer0.com
    • 0.0% downvotes are from lemmy.dbzer0.com
  • Time breakdown
    • 0-15m: +1 up, -1 down
    • 15-30m: +1 up
    • 30-45m: +1 up
    • 45-60m: +1 up
    • 75-90m: +3 up
    • 105-120m: +3 up
• https://lemmy.world/post/33465623
  • Source breakdown
    • 0.0% upvotes are from lemmy.dbzer0.com
    • 5.0% downvotes are from lemmy.dbzer0.com
  • Time breakdown
    • 0-15m: +3 up, -3 down
    • 15-30m: +2 up, -4 down
    • 30-45m: +1 up, -1 down
    • 45-60m: +1 up
    • 60-75m: +3 up, -3 down
    • 75-90m: +1 up, -2 down
    • 90-105m: -1 down
    • 105-120m: +1 up, -6 down
• https://lemmy.world/post/33455276
  • Source breakdown
    • 3.6% upvotes are from lemmy.dbzer0.com
    • 0.0% downvotes are from lemmy.dbzer0.com
  • Time breakdown
    • 0-15m: +12 up, -2 down
    • 15-30m: +9 up, -2 down
    • 30-45m: +11 up
    • 45-60m: +4 up, -1 down
    • 60-75m: +7 up
    • 75-90m: +5 up
    • 90-105m: +2 up
    • 105-120m: +6 up

See? Looks different, right? Maybe it's just me.

Neither of us have information because it's epistemologically impossible to tease out what really motivated voters

100% correct yes. And yet, you have a belief in your mind that makes you convinced that:

I genuinely believe that if trans and LGBT people did not exist, and the Catholic Church was in favor of Biden, probably 80-90 percent of Latinos would have voted Biden.

80-90 percent? So 7% of black people voted for McCain instead of Obama, but you think only a few percent more Latinos than that might potentially have voted for Trump, if it wasn't for those pesky transgenders and if the Catholic church had come out for him?

But your views of Latino thinking are definitely not racist lol. I mean I think I have made my point at this point, we're just reiterating at each other at this point.

Spot check

• "defending neo-Nazis" -> link -> okay goat was just saying exploding-heads.com were not themselves neo Nazis which as far as I was ever aware they were not
• "misgendering" -> well this one is gonna be hard to find, let's look in the old modlog

Really now? Your response is to turn the other cheek to civilians being gunned down on mass throughout your country? Oh, silly harmless Hamas raping women to death, stealing international civilians and slaughtering them inside of their own homes--we won't do anything in response but give you a stern talking to

• by goat

Oh

Oh no

Well

what would they be able to do? i'm the idf. i can bomb hospitals. i have fucking nukes. let the world tweet away

• by goat

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/fighting-rages-israel-says-ready-evacuate-babies-gazas-main-hospital-2023-11-11/

if i was the IDF and I wanted to kill civilians without any witnesses, I’d use my largest and most destructive bomb to really make sure no one captures it on film.

but that’s if I was evil.

Well this has taken a little bit of a turn

Okay so yeah goat's a tool to put it a little bit fucking mildly

https://prri.org/spotlight/hispanic-americans-evolving-support-for-lgbtq-rights/

The issue is not that there is some crazy 10% outlier of Hispanics who are not LGBTQ-bigoted, and I'm blaming you for not including them. The issue is that Hispanics are not bigoted as a majority-position bloc in the same way that you're asserting that they are (to such an extent that it overrode every single other consideration and is obviously why they voted the way they did in the election, which you seemed to take as axiomatic and obviously why they voted for Trump.)

I am helping you, I think. You're not open to accepting new information or having the flaws in your thinking pointed out, you perceive it as something else and a reason to argue with me and claim you're just right and I'm being incorrect at you, but I'm doing it anyway.

Dude watch some of the videos where back in the 80s he was going to Nicaragua and Cuba and coming back and talking on TV about their socialist system and how much better it was than the US system. Search for "bernie sanders 1985" or "bernie sanders 1986" on YouTube, there are a bunch. He is a socialist. This whole "left of MOST Dems" thing is incredibly disingenuous.

Switch "back" to being an independent? He's always been an independent. He ran in the Democratic primary one time, and almost won. That's it. He's an independent. You're trying very hard to paint him into this Democratic-party corner, why?

He "really dropped the ball with Palestine" how? By getting on the Senate floor and yelling about military aid and showing pictures of starving children, repeatedly fighting for bills which would remove Israel's funding and haranguing everyone to vote for them? That's "dropped the ball"? How did he drop the ball?

What fucking falter, what are you talking about? Calling it "ethnic cleansing" instead of "genocide" was your red line, and undoes all the relentless effort he's been putting in to try to stop the US government from helping Israel with their horrifying crimes?

I literally just don't get this. The AOC thing is incredibly stupid, too. I talked more about it here.

Well meanwhileongrad was fun while it lasted I guess lol. Tell me you're a much bigger PTB than even the accusations you got on YPTB, without telling me.

goat's done a couple of weird things that I have observed. I think the most notable was that they made PugJesus a mod, PJ said he didn't want to be a mod, they left him as a mod even with him repeatedly asking not to be, and then a little while later, they made a big public show of deciding he was a Zionist and announcing they were removing him as a mod. It always felt to me like there was more going on with that story.

Anyway yeah it sounds like he's a tool.

If LGBT+ people voted as a large block for Trump because

... and then you filled in your theory for what the "because" was that caused the Latino community to vote for him.

If your "because" were completely accurate, I'd agree with you. But it's not. And since it's not, and because you're implying that every single religious Latino as a bloc has that hateful attitude and using that as your jumping off point, it's racist.

Anything else I can help you with?

🙄

There is a big narrative that loves to pick off the left-est of the left people in the US government, and come up with various bullshit reasons to criticize them.

You'll never hear this kind of argument applied anywhere else. Like, if Beto O'Rourke said Gaza was a genocide, you wouldn't see all these Lemmy comments saying "TOOK YOU FUCKING LONG ENOUGH YOU PIECE OF SHIT" or whatever. When that handful of countries said they wouldn't do sporting events with Israel, I didn't see anyone commenting "YEAH WHERE WAS THIS TWO YEARS AGO WHERE ARE THE FUCKING WAR CRIMES CHARGES" or anything like that. The extensive nitpicking is only aimed at people like AOC and Bernie who are significant leftist voices in government.

If you want to know what Bernie's been actually saying about Gaza, this is it:

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/uVDPXtnTXUw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFhcSlrJcAU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dd4cg-t8j8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2_AWLQ4gk4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBZreokpA_s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRrHfsqg990

And so on. He's been doing what most of Lemmy would like to see someone in the US Congress doing: Yelling about Israel, what a fucking horror it is, and trying to stop US military aid. This extensive nailbiting about him calling it "ethnic cleansing" instead of "genocide" is just going to get smoothly replaced by these users with some other reason to nailbite about him, definitely not with any enthusiasm or support for him. I guarantee it.